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From: devrandom <c1.sf-bitcoin@niftybox.net>
To: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock.name>
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Presenting a BIP for Shamir's Secret Sharing of Bitcoin private keys
Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2014 10:48:25 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1396115305.27001.8.camel@mimiz> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <3760502.BsfnhHlzm1@crushinator>

On Sat, 2014-03-29 at 13:38 -0400, Matt Whitlock wrote:
> On Saturday, 29 March 2014, at 10:25 am, Dev Random wrote:
> > On Sat, 2014-03-29 at 11:44 -0400, Matt Whitlock wrote:
> > > On Saturday, 29 March 2014, at 11:08 am, Watson Ladd wrote:
> > > > https://freedom-to-tinker.com/blog/stevenag/new-research-better-wallet-security-for-bitcoin/
> > > 
> > > Thanks. This is great, although it makes some critical references to an
> > > ACM paper for which no URL is provided, and thus I cannot implement it.
> > > 
> > > A distributed ECDSA notwithstanding, we still need a way to decompose a
> > > BIP32 master seed into shares. I am envisioning a scenario in which I
> > 
> > It would seem that threshold ECDSA with keys derived from separate seeds
> > has better security properties than one seed that is then split up.  The
> > main thing is that there is no single point of attack in the generation
> > or signing.
> 
> No contest here. But can threshold ECDSA work with BIP32? In other
> words, can a threshold ECDSA public key be generated from separate,
> precomputed private keys, or can it only be generated interactively?
> Maybe the BIP32 master seeds have to be generated interactively, and
> then all sets of corresponding derived keys are valid signing groups?

That's a good point. In the paper, they have a deterministic wallet
scheme in section 3.3.  It is non-interactive, so that's good.  On the
other hand, it's not BIP32, so that adds complexity.

> 
> Threshold ECDSA certainly sounds nice, but is anyone working on a BIP
> for it? I would take it on myself, but I don't understand it well
> enough yet, and publicly available information on it seems lacking. I
> proposed this Shamir Secret Sharing BIP as an easily understood, easily
> implemented measure that we can use today, with no changes to existing
> Bitcoin software. It's low-hanging fruit.

Good points, although multisig is catching on quickly in the ecosystem.
AFAIK, all production wallets can send to p2sh addresses.

-- 
Miron / devrandom






  parent reply	other threads:[~2014-03-29 17:48 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 90+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <CACsn0ckScTWG4YxNCscxvtdsmcUkxtR2Gi-rdBs2HCkirPz5rA@mail.gmail.com>
2014-03-29 15:44 ` [Bitcoin-development] Presenting a BIP for Shamir's Secret Sharing of Bitcoin private keys Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 16:59   ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-29 17:19     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:52       ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-29 18:00         ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 18:08           ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-29 18:10             ` Matt Whitlock
     [not found]               ` <CAAt2M18j7bGDsKouVw+e4j+FMiJ4vK6-sx+nrkwHyiKLqiH7Jg@mail.gmail.com>
2014-03-29 19:34                 ` Natanael
2014-04-04  2:38               ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-29 18:16         ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29 18:41           ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-29 17:28     ` Roy Badami
2014-03-29 17:42       ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:51         ` Roy Badami
2014-03-29 17:28   ` devrandom
     [not found]   ` <1396113933.8809.91.camel@mimiz>
2014-03-29 17:38     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:46       ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-03-29 19:49         ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29 17:48       ` devrandom [this message]
2014-03-29 17:51         ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:56           ` devrandom
2014-04-03 12:41 Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-03 21:42 ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 13:51   ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-04 14:14     ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-04 16:05       ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 16:25         ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-04 16:36           ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 17:08             ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-04 17:16               ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 17:51                 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-04 18:53                   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 16:03     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-08  0:33       ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-08  0:38         ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-08  1:46           ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-08  2:07             ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-08 11:52               ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-10 22:31                 ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-22  8:06                   ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22  8:11                     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:27                       ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22  8:29                         ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:39                           ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22  8:43                             ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:51                               ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22  9:13                             ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22 11:50                               ` Justin A
2014-04-22  8:35                       ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:39                         ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22  8:40                           ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:43                             ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22  8:47                               ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:50                                 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22 15:32                           ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-04-22 15:49                             ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22 17:03                               ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-04-22 17:07                               ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22 18:29                                 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22 18:46                                   ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-23  5:33                                     ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-23  6:16                                       ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-05-05 19:36                                         ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-05-12 12:09                                           ` Jan Møller
2014-08-14 19:23                                             ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-22 13:37                       ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-22  8:15                     ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-22  8:49                       ` Jan Møller
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2014-03-29  8:05 Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29  8:34 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29  8:44 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29  8:51   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29  8:54     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 16:54   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:37     ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29  9:08 ` Chris Beams
2014-03-29  9:31   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 11:16   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 11:54     ` Chris Beams
2014-03-29 13:27       ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-29 13:36         ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-29 13:38           ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29 14:10           ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 14:19             ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-29 14:55               ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 15:04                 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-29 14:28             ` Watson Ladd
2014-03-29 14:36               ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-03-29 15:01                 ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29  9:21 ` Chris Beams

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