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[2003:dd:6712:6418:1d2:360e:ce63:5895]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id v65sm8566068wme.31.2019.06.30.03.56.47 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 30 Jun 2019 03:56:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Tamas Blummer Message-Id: <1A808C88-63FD-4F45-8C95-2B8B4D99EDF5@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_28660BD1-B4D0-44FB-A72D-FEE2B8C850D0"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.3 \(3273\)) Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2019 12:56:46 +0200 In-Reply-To: <708D14A9-D25E-4DD2-8B6E-39A1194A7A00@voskuil.org> To: Eric Voskuil References: <0DBC0DEA-C999-4AEE-B2E1-D5337ECD9405@gmail.com> <7A10C0F5-E206-43C1-853F-64AE04F57711@voskuil.org> <708D14A9-D25E-4DD2-8B6E-39A1194A7A00@voskuil.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3273) X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.0 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU, FREEMAIL_FROM, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 30 Jun 2019 17:08:59 +0000 Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Generalized covenants with taproot enable riskless or risky lending, prevent credit inflation through fractional reserve X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2019 10:56:50 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_28660BD1-B4D0-44FB-A72D-FEE2B8C850D0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hi Eric, > On Jun 29, 2019, at 23:21, Eric Voskuil wrote: >=20 > What loan? Alice has paid Bob for something of no possible utility to = her, or anyone else. >=20 Coins encumbered with the described covenant represent temporary control = of a scarce resource. Can this obtain value? That depends on the availability of final control = and ability to deal with temporary control. An example where final control is not available are areas and = jurisdictions where land can not be bought only long time rents are = offered. People pay high prices there to step in place of the renter in an = existing long term rent contract and they figured out the contracts that = work under these restrictions. Bitcoin=E2=80=99s predominant use is already store of value. Many assume = not only wealth preservation but that it would allow to purchase of more = goods in the future than now. This leads to unwillingnes to give up final control, which can resolve = in two ways: - Increasing fiat prices for final control. We see this, and is actually = further reinforcing unwillingnes to give up final control. - dealing with temporary control. We do not yet have the technical means = of even representing this. Developing them is my goal. I think you do not show the neccesary respect of the market. Your rant reminds me of renowed economists who still argue final control = Bitcoin can not have value, you do the same proclaiming that temporary = control of Bitcoin can not have value. I say, that temporary control does not have value until means dealing = with it are offered, and that is I work on. Thereafter might obtain = value if final control is deemed too expensive or not attainable, we = shall see. Tamas Blummer --Apple-Mail=_28660BD1-B4D0-44FB-A72D-FEE2B8C850D0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEE6YNJViYMM6Iv5f9e9nKRxRdxORwFAl0YlW4ACgkQ9nKRxRdx ORy/TwgAx0PEkYsC7Ym7kg6fKFHZglOTjPWn6qexfkqxl49xH0+lFy/EGXjCZk6d LnxPQYMQCIoSP5Ix5kU4gTM5R62TgLIf+9bBJyCqh6iDQWzv/Tq7W/JayHwLgPn3 B98iXoSh4++Xn6Gb6Ira2Uk3X2JBMTDFoZgXtnJU5t2ZVbVUwtUkFOn3wnD/Oj1X 4k/E+OZyNUqcEiv4raqT3rReu1FT39MxIyB5hrbWvNA4QMeYreAPkQ6NkCAVxzFy 7eraZAXXKJT3vTGH3rxpNwIEhnhoS2+o7awbuDyUMWCaUcsm2TJZy25sTh5fZpEx WsIfz5rSCycvZCweBm4PA8GP78BzMA== =G6W/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_28660BD1-B4D0-44FB-A72D-FEE2B8C850D0--