From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from sog-mx-1.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.191] helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-2.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1VZLwB-00024E-DT for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Thu, 24 Oct 2013 14:30:59 +0000 Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-1.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of petertodd.org designates 62.13.149.81 as permitted sender) client-ip=62.13.149.81; envelope-from=pete@petertodd.org; helo=outmail149081.authsmtp.net; Received: from outmail149081.authsmtp.net ([62.13.149.81]) by sog-mx-1.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) id 1VZLwA-0005uk-8c for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Thu, 24 Oct 2013 14:30:59 +0000 Received: from mail-c235.authsmtp.com (mail-c235.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.235]) by punt12.authsmtp.com (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id r9OEUpad079133 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2013 15:30:51 +0100 (BST) Received: from savin (76-10-178-109.dsl.teksavvy.com [76.10.178.109]) (authenticated bits=128) by mail.authsmtp.com (8.14.2/8.14.2/) with ESMTP id r9OEUiiB043119 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2013 15:30:47 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2013 10:30:43 -0400 From: Peter Todd To: Bitcoin Dev Message-ID: <20131024143043.GA12658@savin> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="YZ5djTAD1cGYuMQK" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Server-Quench: dfb8c91c-3cb8-11e3-b802-002590a15da7 X-AuthReport-Spam: If SPAM / abuse - report it at: http://www.authsmtp.com/abuse X-AuthRoute: OCd2Yg0TA1ZNQRgX IjsJECJaVQIpKltL GxAVJwpGK10IU0Fd P1hXKl1LNVAaWXld WiVPGEoXDxgzCjYj NEgGOBsDNw4AXQF1 LxsNXVBSFQZ4ABkL BR4UVh48cANYeX5u ZEFqQHFbVVt/fUFi QwAWHBJzAD45GmAb U0FZfk1RcQpOMEsT OFgsXXJefGZUNHJ9 RlY+ZHU7bW0FbXwN GFxcdVtLHEoCQSgZ ThMDGzpnE0AIDygo Mx0jI0IdG0BZOEgu LVY7MQAA X-Authentic-SMTP: 61633532353630.1023:706 X-AuthFastPath: 0 (Was 255) X-AuthSMTP-Origin: 76.10.178.109/587 X-AuthVirus-Status: No virus detected - but ensure you scan with your own anti-virus system. 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[URIs: petertodd.org] X-Headers-End: 1VZLwA-0005uk-8c Subject: [Bitcoin-development] Making fee estimation better X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2013 14:30:59 -0000 --YZ5djTAD1cGYuMQK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Quick thought on how to make blockchain-based fee estimates work better in the context of out-of-band mining contracts: have miners advertise in their coinbase's what fees were actually paid, as opposed to appear to have been paid. The logic is very simple: we assume miners aren't an effective cartel and are willing to undercut each other. Therefore it's in their interests for people to broadcast a transaction with a fee that is competitive the first time around so they can get onto mining it immediately. Granted, those incentives may not be as strong as one would like, and there could be some perverse ones as well, but it's a line of thought worth thinking about more. A related idea: let miners advertise a address to submit transactions too. (like a node IP) The inherent proof-of-work is nice and could help people more securely find someone to connect too with the inherent proof that a lot of work went into mining the block with the address in it. Obviously, lots of downsides too, but it's a different security model than other forms of bootstrapping, and that's probably useful in of itself. --=20 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org 0000000000000001fce0617deb31cc20bec2903cd10dc352ac3b2fc1af6b27f0 --YZ5djTAD1cGYuMQK Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iQGrBAEBCACVBQJSaS8TXhSAAAAAABUAQGJsb2NraGFzaEBiaXRjb2luLm9yZzAw MDAwMDAwMDAwMDAwMDBiZjdiY2YzZGExYjNiMjI4MjE2YjcyZmVmY2NiZWQ4NGJl Y2FhYmE2ZmNjNmFmZjIvFIAAAAAAFQARcGthLWFkZHJlc3NAZ251cGcub3JncGV0 ZUBwZXRlcnRvZC5vcmcACgkQJIFAPaXwkfucbAf+JP2ZK84t+1EAGBMasOH/eUtr hm5AiNmxIXPeyH1yXibT6IpnudabbqxaEqas54uDQhW+X3Z5UwD9eP40KIqicLcC bKkaVWkKs6JhZRfln2snyKvL8lYHSxjvWI8KifbZc4IO9b7u9WtSA2HSnSPx5wwg M+CkxzvujZrNqnwX1y7g0+JlaIrmRFgqdr07zfOehvdzz4sYA05uyZqYS25cXVZb jclmgzzH6TC7WX98fPNMMkWxL0lxi8REDcRO6c5iSta9NfLKrFkm+n11ANF0kkyd 4x3ueWZPHLbJF4v6mt/sq5c42U5h7Kphhbig7AAzESQ1osD6EPOAw4FtoI6s4A== =uAha -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --YZ5djTAD1cGYuMQK--