From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 263293EE for ; Tue, 3 May 2016 09:20:54 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: from auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from outmail149084.authsmtp.net (outmail149084.authsmtp.net [62.13.149.84]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27893148 for ; Tue, 3 May 2016 09:20:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-c232.authsmtp.com (mail-c232.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.232]) by punt22.authsmtp.com (8.14.2/8.14.2/) with ESMTP id u439KoxL000685; Tue, 3 May 2016 10:20:50 +0100 (BST) Received: from petertodd.org (ec2-52-5-185-120.compute-1.amazonaws.com [52.5.185.120]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.authsmtp.com (8.14.2/8.14.2/) with ESMTP id u439Km2d072365 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 3 May 2016 10:20:49 +0100 (BST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by petertodd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 393E540194; Tue, 3 May 2016 09:19:37 +0000 (UTC) Received: by localhost (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 1B734238DE; Mon, 2 May 2016 22:05:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 2 May 2016 22:05:11 -0400 From: Peter Todd To: Kristov Atlas Message-ID: <20160503020511.GK15664@fedora-21-dvm> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="wIc/V6YLA2QdyfT4" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.23 (2014-03-12) X-Server-Quench: 53443a40-1110-11e6-829e-00151795d556 X-AuthReport-Spam: If SPAM / abuse - report it at: http://www.authsmtp.com/abuse X-AuthRoute: OCd2Yg0TA1ZNQRgX IjsJECJaVQIpKltL GxAVKBZePFsRUQkR aAdMdgEUFVQNAgsB AmAbWlReUl17XWo7 bghPaBtcak9QXgdq T0pMXVMcUQFrCGdc BEoeVRtxcQAIfX1z YQhnXXRfXxV+dVt8 Q09UCGwHMGF9YGIW BV1YdwJRcQRDe0tA b1YxNiYHcQ5VPz4z GA41ejw8IwAXMyla XQARZUkPS10KEi90 ThYOVTAyGVEEAj4+ KRArMBZcF0EQNEc1 MF1gOxoEKRYUEQRV A0BKBjQx X-Authentic-SMTP: 61633532353630.1037:706 X-AuthFastPath: 0 (Was 255) X-AuthSMTP-Origin: 52.5.185.120/25 X-AuthVirus-Status: No virus detected - but ensure you scan with your own anti-virus system. X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, DATE_IN_PAST_06_12, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=no version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 03 May 2016 10:59:50 +0000 Cc: Bitcoin Dev Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] segwit subsidy and multi-sender (coinjoin) transactions X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 May 2016 09:20:54 -0000 --wIc/V6YLA2QdyfT4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Apr 29, 2016 at 02:22:32PM -0400, Kristov Atlas via bitcoin-dev wro= te: > A sample of the 16 transaction id's posted in the JoinMarket thread on > BitcoinTalk shows an average ratio of 1.38 or outputs to inputs: >=20 > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1p9jZYXxX1HDtKCxTy79Zj5PrQaF20mxbD= 7BAuz0KC8s/edit?usp=3Dsharing >=20 > As we know, a "traditional" CoinJoin transaction creates roughly 2x UTXOs > for everyone 1 it consumes -- 1 spend and 1 change -- unless address reuse > comes into play. Note how this is obviously an unsustainable situation - at some point that change needs to be combined again, or you're throwing away money in the for= m of UTXO's that aren't ever getting spent. Meanwhile, if you put it another way the segwit discount is an obvious advantage for coinjoin: by making spending UTXO's cheaper, we can recover t= hose funds that would otherwise get lost to dust, becoming ever more difficult to spend. --=20 https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org --wIc/V6YLA2QdyfT4 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJXKAdTAAoJEGOZARBE6K+ys1UH/0fi6TWxKqS8Bf/ArCZ4E08L 9y0agff67OteStCHCp1CZ8X1TkM4E4Odd943XhsvVjMgH3/UjqlsW44t6aSVIk5T dc5prMn5Qr6wOQ3LJ/qp7/nBOrkj9TmGe8ezQZ5RfvDcflKeYt8CtytvMsqn8L5H PZTJ5OqONfcpY7sVL3lVGYfjSBn1wHFUN37Wc1dF/Uoh+/M/RPirq92gfTDcQ0MB +a3VSe4EnxyZIrL/pEs2xfSx/ZPpFaoLF2wTcHdj1Eq2W9q0/wauUoaAHyVOWT6J vailgl3PBwOWtdNFVS+QJ5qhbbcr88NOIRBfsuLAtUC1ICP1aFwR8qlNvDZIvcY= =oVxK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --wIc/V6YLA2QdyfT4--