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(8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 19RK2i4x016526; Wed, 27 Oct 2021 21:02:44 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from user@petertodd.org) Received: from petertodd.org (76-10-157-59.dsl.teksavvy.com [76.10.157.59]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail.authsmtp.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id 19RK2gd8042762 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 27 Oct 2021 21:02:44 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from user@petertodd.org) Received: by petertodd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3851388794; Wed, 27 Oct 2021 16:02:42 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=petertodd.org; s=mail; t=1635364962; bh=0xxhU4C2YCDPxb+0714SW+L/EQ0JsRGZ/nXrSt2wTRw=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=Oxx/53PuxWhHgvRW2ojMGP/Ctfu5YQf6Xk/UkihOZ37tuFVZF1UMOEfP2LCzYy/23 qWzAP/PbqFti7GLZzYzbgwjgztEwMnr//whs4+56rhuKwvxmk0+w4z8cJGTWWC4ceG T8MkML4DKoRLB7+cJiJ7vu6O4FHMEttag/kNX0QUGgPFCaKXI2NlkEEQUY/picRwbu IHiemYD37hDi03GYZmZnsmoOqEJHn6o4xJpsi8YCzAyR0SiZCsLn5U0HhOHqVEcnUY U+0mOWoDUuPLAfXKZbXDCtTGF4ubfy2IhqTtIrTthLaItPq4vI1i/4cP1fotBL2vf2 +9ZK+liS779Kw== Received: by localhost (Postfix, from userid 1000) id BA1C85F806; Wed, 27 Oct 2021 16:01:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2021 16:01:51 -0400 From: Peter Todd To: Antoine Riard , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Message-ID: <20211027200151.GC5674@petertodd.org> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="p2kqVDKq5asng8Dg" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.1 (2018-07-13) X-Server-Quench: d95685d1-3760-11ec-a0f2-84349711df28 X-AuthReport-Spam: If SPAM / abuse - report it at: http://www.authsmtp.com/abuse X-AuthRoute: OCd2Yg0TA1ZIVwkA IjsJECJaVQIpKltL GxAVKBZePFsRUQkR aQdMdAUUF1YAAgsB AWcbWVVeUF97XWc7 bAxPbAVDY09JQQBj T0pMXVMcFQwKeh5W UhYeVht1cQcIeX55 YEUsCnleWkx/IUdg QUlSFXAHZDIzdTEf BkJFfwdXdApNfx4R PFJ3GhFYa3VsNCMk FAgyOXU9MCtqYChY Sx0NZU4VCVoLE3Y5 ShUaGjIrWQUBQCM8 ZxgnNFNUAEYcekA/ NEMmXlZw X-Authentic-SMTP: 61633532353630.1021:7600 X-AuthFastPath: 0 (Was 255) X-AuthSMTP-Origin: 76.10.157.59/25 X-AuthVirus-Status: No virus detected - but ensure you scan with your own anti-virus system. Cc: lisa neigut Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] death to the mempool, long live the mempool X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2021 20:18:11 -0000 --p2kqVDKq5asng8Dg Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Oct 26, 2021 at 07:44:45PM -0400, Antoine Riard via bitcoin-dev wro= te: > Such a list of endpoints couldn't be static otherwise it's an artificial > barrier to enter in the mining competition, and as such a centralization > vector. Dynamic, trust-minimized discovery of the mining endpoints assumes > an address-relay network, of which the robustness must be high enough > against sophisticated sybil attacks. One current defense mechanism in core > to achieve that is selecting outbound peers based in different /16 subnets > as it's harder for an attacker to obtain IP addresses. Replicating this > mechanism for the mining endpoints binds the mining topology to the > Internet one, which is downgrading the mining competition. I think a really simple way to put it is if we didn't have the mempool, it'= d be good to create a free service that got transactions to miners in an equal opportunity, decentralized, way. A simple flood fill scheme would be a great way to do that... at which point you've re-invented the mempool. Nothing wrong with people running nodes that opt-out of transaction broadcasting, and it may even make sense for such nodes to preferentially p= eer with each other. But there's always going to be a need for a scheme like the existing mempool, so might as well just keep it. --=20 https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org --p2kqVDKq5asng8Dg Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEFcyURjhyM68BBPYTJIFAPaXwkfsFAmF5sCoACgkQJIFAPaXw kfs2vAf8CS4po949ezH2e78VkH2wU4iZqe0yBp4AdFQrckNsB0HHlSMfwHtg/Cgk OXrM/ywYg+Qo90en6hOxBd/seJ+ODYkkokC73u+effYLYY8NQebFs/aE8Agk/3+W I+7LK586EJWehBvp9AusdEKi0G0X5p1USZYk9nUtY38jBePmGZbzf+gUGop607Ml yrzyBJHqB3cSsLdpXnHSiO1MG+aWkBiz0HesNnpeHYcRkUOUETsE9WNQFfkYeOm5 w5EnnliOUjZeXdl7h24E0RIDS/gB9c/GjZ4kpjSyTAGyJyaUxLM50zkiuzdsXk2G ++EYNO3vbAp+sftMnBi95F+gLnQT9g== =ru2L -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --p2kqVDKq5asng8Dg--