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From: Mashuri Clark <mashuribc@gmail.com>
To: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org, Owen <ogunden@phauna.org>,
	 Eric Lombrozo <elombrozo@gmail.com>
Cc: Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Eli Dourado on "governance"
Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2015 13:28:27 +0000 (UTC)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <207C5360C6E6B691.029C42D2-8BAC-43F4-A8B3-CD9B9EAAA319@mail.outlook.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <835E3F90-C057-4240-9EB6-D2C7400B662B@gmail.com>

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CORRECTION: That's Paul Sztorc. Not Peter.  Apologies for my abysmal proofreading.

--
MC




On Tue, Aug 4, 2015 at 8:08 PM -0700, "Eric Lombrozo via bitcoin-dev" <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:










Rather than speculating on fake markets, why don’t we use theory, empirical data, and engineering to fix the damn problems?
On Aug 4, 2015, at 11:28 AM, Owen via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
Given there is no money at stake in these prediction games, it is no surprise that the results are implausible.

On August 4, 2015 10:22:19 AM EDT, Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
On 4 August 2015 at 01:22, Gavin Andresen via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
And the preliminary results of using a prediction market to try to wrestle with the tough tradeoffs looks roughly correct to me, too:   https://blocksizedebate.com/
​The scicast prediction market is shutdown atm (since early July?) so those numbers aren't live. But...
Network hash rate
 3,255.17 PH/s  (same block size) 5,032.64 PH/s  (block size increase)

 4,969.68 PH/s  (no replace-by-fee)
 3,132.09 PH/s  (replace-by-fee)
Those numbers seem completely implausible: that's ~2.9-3.6 doublings of the current hashrate (< 400PH/s) in 17 months, when it's taken 12 months for the last doubling, and there's a block reward reduction due in that period too. (That might've been a reasonable prediction sometime in the past year, when doublings were slowing from once every ~45 days to once a year; it just doesn't seem a supportable prediction now)
That the PH/s rate is higher with bigger blocks is surprising, but given that site also predicts USD/BTC will be $280 with no change but $555 with bigger blocks, so I assume that difference is mostly due to price. Also, 12.5btc at $555 each is about 23 btc at $300 each, so if that price increase is realistic, it would compensate for almost all of the block reward reduction.
Daily transaction volume 168,438.22 tx/day  (same block size) 193,773.08 tx/day  (block size increase)
 192,603.80 tx/day  (no replace-by-fee) 168,406.73 tx/day  (replace-by-fee)

That's only a 15% increase in transaction volume due to the block size increase; I would have expected more? 168k-194k tx/day is also only a 30%-50% increase in transaction volume from 130k tx/day currently. If that's really the case, then a 1.5MB-2MB max block size would probably be enough for the next two years...
(Predicting that the node count will drop from ~5000 to ~1200 due to increasing block sizes seems quite an indictment as far as centralisation risks go; but given I'm not that convinced by the other predictions, I'm not sure I want to give that much weight to that one either)
Cheers,aj
-- 
Anthony Towns <aj@erisian.com.au>


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  parent reply	other threads:[~2015-08-05 13:28 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 29+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-08-03 15:22 [bitcoin-dev] Eli Dourado on "governance" Gavin Andresen
     [not found] ` <1438640036.2828.0.camel@auspira.com>
2015-08-03 22:21   ` Gavin Andresen
2015-08-04  6:40     ` [bitcoin-dev] "A Transaction Fee Market Exists Without a Block Size Limit"--new research paper suggests Peter R
2015-08-04 18:41       ` Dave Hudson
2015-08-04 21:18         ` Peter Todd
2015-08-04 21:30         ` Gavin Andresen
2015-08-04 21:46           ` Peter Todd
2015-08-05  0:26             ` Milly Bitcoin
2015-08-05  0:40               ` Neil Fincham
2015-08-04 23:37           ` Dave Hudson
2015-08-05 22:15         ` Peter R
2015-08-05 22:44           ` Dave Hudson
2015-08-05 23:45             ` Tom Harding
2015-08-05  8:33       ` Benjamin
2015-08-05  9:18         ` Hector Chu
2015-08-05  9:57           ` Adam Back
2015-08-05 10:51             ` Hector Chu
2015-08-05 11:07               ` Adam Back
2015-08-05 11:35                 ` Hector Chu
2015-08-05 19:04                   ` Hector Chu
2015-08-05 10:26         ` Peter R
     [not found]       ` <CAAS2fgTzeFnmnr2ScZvf1pDUtF+M3HhF9xo0yhjVPObpqhgz0A@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]         ` <6ED57388-6EC3-4515-BF3F-E753301537AB@gmx.com>
     [not found]           ` <CAAS2fgRoFna4i-d=hpmz-CpV35VQ=J1aEoTTT6B1oD4f15C1KA@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]             ` <C8B38FEC-0EF2-483F-9E53-43AB937455A0@gmx.com>
     [not found]               ` <CAAS2fgQjXNTi9Y_YwLg2dR8baYZhvmEjw43ictt749zR2AOEWw@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]                 ` <6FED5604-4A6F-4CE1-B42E-36626375D557@gmx.com>
     [not found]                   ` <CAAS2fgQ7hRRvRtD8igcZ2aWBmnqre6iM27peCFGxgC8ODb9jgw@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]                     ` <6BA86443-7534-4AAA-92BC-EC9B1603DE5F@gmx.com>
     [not found]                       ` <CAAS2fgTTZKD9LQHpMmEH0OU=T8Ta7cCaavWzhM1yQ68-MAT8UQ@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]                         ` <27B16AB4-0DAD-4665-BF08-7A0C0A70D8D8@gmx.com>
     [not found]                           ` <CAAS2fgRm_CSmWgr7CGmBUD0nX+V0fJ8N4TQN01Vchgip9-s6uQ@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]                             ` <CAAS2fgT+DP+DaoCMG276uF4=Yoi-w40YyNP-RDRG7NQgOmtpGw@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]                               ` <CAEgR2PGn_SER18sMuKPJJz5RT=1K=346eCm ph5FJQhhoLcV1zw@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]                                 ` <CAEgR2PGn_SER18sMuKPJJz5RT=1K=346eCmph5FJQhhoLcV1zw@mail.gmail.com>
2015-08-30 20:08                                   ` Peter R
2015-08-30 21:02                                     ` Daniele Pinna
2015-08-04 14:22 ` [bitcoin-dev] Eli Dourado on "governance" Anthony Towns
2015-08-04 18:28   ` Owen
2015-08-05  3:07     ` Eric Lombrozo
2015-08-05  6:32       ` Mashuri Clark
2015-08-05 13:28       ` Mashuri Clark [this message]
2015-08-07 16:26 ` Thomas Zander

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