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From: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock.name>
To: Alan Reiner <etotheipi@gmail.com>
Cc: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Presenting a BIP for Shamir's Secret Sharing of Bitcoin private keys
Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2014 14:00:15 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <2135731.4HGHfZWzo5@crushinator> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <53370854.5050303@gmail.com>

On Saturday, 29 March 2014, at 1:52 pm, Alan Reiner wrote:
> On 03/29/2014 01:19 PM, Matt Whitlock wrote:
> > I intentionally omitted the parameter M (minimum subset size) from the shares because including it would give an adversary a vital piece of information. Likewise, including any kind of information that would allow a determination of whether the secret has been correctly reconstituted would give an adversary too much information. Failing silently when given incorrect shares or an insufficient number of shares is intentional.
> 
> I do not believe this is a good tradeoff.  It's basically obfuscation of
> something that is already considered secure at the expense of
> usability.  It's much more important to me that the user understands
> what is in their hands (or their family members after they get hit by a
> bus), than to obfuscate the parameters of the secret sharing to provide
> a tiny disadvantage to an adversary who gets ahold of one. 
> 
> The fact that it fails silently is really all downside, not a benefit. 
> If I have enough fragments, I can reconstruct the seed and see that it
> produces addresses with money.  If not, I know I need more fragments. 
> I'm much more concerned about my family having all the info they need to
> recover the money, than an attacker knowing that he needs two more
> fragments instead of which are well-secured anyway.

For what it's worth, ssss also omits from the shares any information about the threshold. It will happily return a garbage secret if too few shares are combined. (And actually, it will happily return a garbage secret if too *many* shares are combined, too. My implementation does not have that problem.)



  reply	other threads:[~2014-03-29 18:00 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 90+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <CACsn0ckScTWG4YxNCscxvtdsmcUkxtR2Gi-rdBs2HCkirPz5rA@mail.gmail.com>
2014-03-29 15:44 ` [Bitcoin-development] Presenting a BIP for Shamir's Secret Sharing of Bitcoin private keys Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 16:59   ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-29 17:19     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:52       ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-29 18:00         ` Matt Whitlock [this message]
2014-03-29 18:08           ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-29 18:10             ` Matt Whitlock
     [not found]               ` <CAAt2M18j7bGDsKouVw+e4j+FMiJ4vK6-sx+nrkwHyiKLqiH7Jg@mail.gmail.com>
2014-03-29 19:34                 ` Natanael
2014-04-04  2:38               ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-29 18:16         ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29 18:41           ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-29 17:28     ` Roy Badami
2014-03-29 17:42       ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:51         ` Roy Badami
2014-03-29 17:28   ` devrandom
     [not found]   ` <1396113933.8809.91.camel@mimiz>
2014-03-29 17:38     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:46       ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-03-29 19:49         ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29 17:48       ` devrandom
2014-03-29 17:51         ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:56           ` devrandom
2014-04-03 12:41 Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-03 21:42 ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 13:51   ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-04 14:14     ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-04 16:05       ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 16:25         ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-04 16:36           ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 17:08             ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-04 17:16               ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 17:51                 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-04 18:53                   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-04 16:03     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-08  0:33       ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-08  0:38         ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-08  1:46           ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-08  2:07             ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-08 11:52               ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-10 22:31                 ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-22  8:06                   ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22  8:11                     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:27                       ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22  8:29                         ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:39                           ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22  8:43                             ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:51                               ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22  9:13                             ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22 11:50                               ` Justin A
2014-04-22  8:35                       ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:39                         ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22  8:40                           ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:43                             ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22  8:47                               ` Matt Whitlock
2014-04-22  8:50                                 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22 15:32                           ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-04-22 15:49                             ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22 17:03                               ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-04-22 17:07                               ` Jan Møller
2014-04-22 18:29                                 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-22 18:46                                   ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-23  5:33                                     ` Tamas Blummer
2014-04-23  6:16                                       ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-05-05 19:36                                         ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-05-12 12:09                                           ` Jan Møller
2014-08-14 19:23                                             ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-22 13:37                       ` Nikita Schmidt
2014-04-22  8:15                     ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-04-22  8:49                       ` Jan Møller
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2014-03-29  8:05 Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29  8:34 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29  8:44 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29  8:51   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29  8:54     ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 16:54   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 17:37     ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29  9:08 ` Chris Beams
2014-03-29  9:31   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 11:16   ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 11:54     ` Chris Beams
2014-03-29 13:27       ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-29 13:36         ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-29 13:38           ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-29 14:10           ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 14:19             ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-29 14:55               ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29 15:04                 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-29 14:28             ` Watson Ladd
2014-03-29 14:36               ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-03-29 15:01                 ` Matt Whitlock
2014-03-29  9:21 ` Chris Beams

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