From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.193] helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-2.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1YPCWH-0003Ke-5N for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Sat, 21 Feb 2015 16:03:05 +0000 Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of gmail.com designates 209.85.192.45 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.192.45; envelope-from=ctpacia@gmail.com; helo=mail-qg0-f45.google.com; Received: from mail-qg0-f45.google.com ([209.85.192.45]) by sog-mx-3.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) id 1YPCWF-0005MZ-BD for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Sat, 21 Feb 2015 16:03:05 +0000 Received: by mail-qg0-f45.google.com with SMTP id h3so18655045qgf.4 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2015 08:02:58 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.140.202.144 with SMTP id x138mr7059825qha.14.1424534577909; Sat, 21 Feb 2015 08:02:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.0.0.15] (c-76-118-174-159.hsd1.nh.comcast.net. [76.118.174.159]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id j10sm8422483qae.36.2015.02.21.08.02.56 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Feb 2015 08:02:57 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <54E8AC69.4000102@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 11:03:53 -0500 From: Chris Pacia User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------050104040104070808030701" X-Spam-Score: -0.6 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net. See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details. -1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for sender-domain 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (ctpacia[at]gmail.com) -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 1.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message -0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain 0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid -0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature X-Headers-End: 1YPCWF-0005MZ-BD Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] bloom filtering, privacy X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 16:03:05 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050104040104070808030701 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Adam seems to be making sense to me. Only querying a single node when an address in my wallet matches the block filter seems to be pretty efficient. The downside is it relies entirely on Tor for privacy, but then again it's not the only aspect of spv clients that require it for privacy (there's broadcasting for example). And on a related note, if we eventually do end up receiving bip70 payments directly, we still need to query for block inclusion and that would seem to be an easy way to do it. On 02/20/2015 12:53 PM, Mike Hearn wrote: > > This is talking about a committed bloom filter. Not a committed > UTXO set. > > > I read the following comment to mean it requires the UTXO commitments. > Otherwise I'm not sure how you prove absence of withholding with just > current block structures+an extra filter included in the block: > > but with the bloom commitment (and UTXO trie organised commitment) he > can verify that the positive hits are correct via the merkle path, and > that the false positives are not being wrongly withheld by obtaining > merkle path proof that they are not in the trie > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server > from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards > with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more > Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=190641631&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk > > > _______________________________________________ > Bitcoin-development mailing list > Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development --------------050104040104070808030701 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Adam seems to be making sense to me. Only querying a single node when an address in my wallet matches the block filter seems to be pretty efficient. The downside is it relies entirely on Tor for privacy, but then again it's not the only aspect of spv clients that require it for privacy (there's broadcasting for example).

And on a related note, if we eventually do end up receiving bip70 payments directly, we still need to query for block inclusion and that would seem to be an easy way to do it.

On 02/20/2015 12:53 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
This is talking about a committed bloom filter. Not a committed UTXO set.

I read the following comment to mean it requires the UTXO commitments. Otherwise I'm not sure how you prove absence of withholding with just current block structures+an extra filter included in the block:

but with the bloom commitment (and UTXO trie organised commitment) he
can verify that the positive hits are correct via the merkle path, and
that the false positives are not being wrongly withheld by obtaining
merkle path proof that they are not in the trie 




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