From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8695C99 for ; Mon, 3 Aug 2015 07:16:22 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-pd0-f179.google.com (mail-pd0-f179.google.com [209.85.192.179]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5B0BC89 for ; Mon, 3 Aug 2015 07:16:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: by pdrg1 with SMTP id g1so70629780pdr.2 for ; Mon, 03 Aug 2015 00:16:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to :cc:subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=OluH6tG+0Jh5h1IHGq9ol4jAx9Wg6TsRCtvWkTsI28k=; b=Bj7I22XJrUIZztg1MrCLXsFlYR9nHosgRU1k5WjicCxmNklcX257nTknG6OifgIyOg ulIVLfzzdlCsxlf6ZLTr8eIhPlB7qCpHPKAVWo/1kHctCl+VqsdnypcwDEQ8JICttSHg ciHa/0aHhphoZaVHzdQZ5irylnmg2j1mlj4NZ0JhZyIYs11duzPWFeO0gwEyPHajRYa+ BgA+Fb5DrR5U9HX7+UV5Xtm8SsLuFMait5vUBnQaPBoAJI8IkHzLEt7OlF/3oO5Kfnf/ 7AdKM7C3c1wkZImmJlyxWhmE/YF3Fm4iEfb+xrFMIx5uUh53KlMmHyxy/FU19NsHkGMV TmHQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQmorYS8YwvRko8dCxli0a2wH1+okyFcnyAIMt7Ym/3jA/OwSj+TPfCzUE1uZX1DbB0/2aXQ X-Received: by 10.70.109.199 with SMTP id hu7mr33142314pdb.71.1438586177986; Mon, 03 Aug 2015 00:16:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.2.15] (c-24-5-43-190.hsd1.ca.comcast.net. [24.5.43.190]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id ud2sm6737976pbc.57.2015.08.03.00.16.12 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 03 Aug 2015 00:16:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <55BF153B.9030001@bitcartel.com> Date: Mon, 03 Aug 2015 00:16:11 -0700 From: Simon Liu User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Adam Back , Jim Phillips References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org Cc: Bitcoin Dev Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] A reason we can all agree on to increase block size X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Aug 2015 07:16:22 -0000 Increasing the block size shouldn't be a problem for Chinese miners. Five of the largest - F2Pool, Antpool, BW, BTCChina, Huobi - have already signed a draft agreement indicating they are fine with an increase to 8 MB: http://www.8btc.com/blocksize-increase-2 With regards to China's international bandwidth, not only is intra-Asia capacity improving all the time, a major consortium cable FASTER is coming online Q2 2016. Backed by Google, China Telecom and others, it has a capacity of 60 Tbps, making it the highest-capacity data link ever created across the Pacific. Interactive map: http://www.submarinecablemap.com/ FASTER: https://plus.google.com/+UrsH%C3%B6lzle/posts/haJzDXnp9Z4 --Simon On 08/02/2015 11:34 PM, Adam Back via bitcoin-dev wrote: > If block-sizes are increased in a way detrimental to the Chinese miners, > it is not the Chinese miners that lose, it is all of the non-Chinese > miners - this is because the Chinese miners have the slight majority of > the hashrate. The relatively low external bandwidth connecting China to > the net is actually the problem of the non-Chinese miners problem. Non > Chinese miners will experience higher orphan rate once Chinese miners > cease to build on top of blocks that are too large to sync in a timely > fashion into China. > > Adam > > On 2 August 2015 at 23:02, Jim Phillips via bitcoin-dev > > wrote: > > China is a communist country. It is no secret that all "capitalist" > enterprises are essentially State controlled, or at the very least > are subject to nationalization should the State deem it necessary. > Most ASIC chips are manufactured in China, so they are cheap and > accessible to Chinese miners. Electricity is subsidized and > essentially free. Cooling is not an issue since large parts of China > are mountainous and naturally cool. In short the Chinese miners have > HUGE advantages over all other mining operations. This is probably > why, between just the top 4 Chinese miners, the People's Republic of > China effectively controls 57% of all the Bitcoin being mined. > > The ONLY disadvantage the Chinese miners have in competing with the > rest of the world is bandwidth. China has poor connectivity with the > rest of the world, and Chinese miners have said that an increase in > the block size would be detrimental to them. I say, GOOD! Most of > the free world has enough bandwidth to be able to handle larger > blocks. We need to take advantage of that fact to get mining out of > the centralized control of the Chinese. > > If you're truly worried about larger blocks causing centralization, > think about how, by restricting blocksize, you're enabling the > Communist Chinese government to maintain centralized control over > 57% of the Bitcoin hashing power. > > -- > *James G. Phillips > IV* > /"Don't bunt. Aim out of the ball park. Aim for the company of > immortals." -- David Ogilvy > / > > /This message was created with 100% recycled electrons. Please > think twice before printing./ > > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > > > > > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev >