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[103.168.172.151]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id e9e14a558f8ab-3d975e22be4si5574225ab.1.2025.05.06.01.57.09 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 06 May 2025 01:57:09 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of sjors@sprovoost.nl designates 103.168.172.151 as permitted sender) client-ip=103.168.172.151; Received: from phl-compute-01.internal (phl-compute-01.phl.internal [10.202.2.41]) by mailfout.phl.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 422B8138101C for ; Tue, 6 May 2025 04:57:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from phl-mailfrontend-01 ([10.202.2.162]) by phl-compute-01.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 06 May 2025 04:57:09 -0400 X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeefvddrtddtgddvkeefheehucetufdoteggodetrf dotffvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggv pdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpih gvnhhtshculddquddttddmnecujfgurhephfgtgfgguffffhfvjgfkofesthhqmhdthhdt vdenucfhrhhomhepufhjohhrshcurfhrohhvohhoshhtuceoshhjohhrshesshhprhhovh hoohhsthdrnhhlqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeekleeviefflefggeffhfffheelueff hfdvffeghfdvfedvudehheetfeekjeeiheenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurf grrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehsjhhorhhssehsphhrohhvohhoshhtrdhnlhdpnhgs pghrtghpthhtohepuddpmhhouggvpehsmhhtphhouhhtpdhrtghpthhtohepsghithgtoh hinhguvghvsehgohhoghhlvghgrhhouhhpshdrtghomh X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: ie5e042df:Fastmail Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA for ; Tue, 6 May 2025 04:57:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Sjors Provoost Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3826.500.181.1.5\)) Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] Weak blocks give an advantage to large miners Date: Tue, 6 May 2025 10:56:56 +0200 References: <9c50244f-0ca0-40a5-8b76-01ba0d67ec1bn@googlegroups.com> <0b6ac4cf-1f58-42b4-823a-8b35fad9f17fn@googlegroups.com> To: Bitcoin Development Mailing List In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <5E8FF16C-A962-478E-A965-129EBEEB8E28@sprovoost.nl> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3826.500.181.1.5) X-Original-Sender: sjors@sprovoost.nl X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@sprovoost.nl header.s=fm1 header.b=wHzRhD7T; dkim=pass header.i=@messagingengine.com header.s=fm3 header.b=BdXeJIZT; spf=pass (google.com: domain of sjors@sprovoost.nl designates 103.168.172.151 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=sjors@sprovoost.nl; dmarc=pass (p=NONE sp=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=sprovoost.nl Precedence: list Mailing-list: list bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; contact bitcoindev+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 786775582512 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -0.8 (/) > Op 5 mei 2025, om 23:34 heeft Peter Todd het volgende geschreven: > > On Mon, May 05, 2025 at 07:18:57PM +1000, Anthony Towns wrote: >> I meant to mention this last email, but had forgotten where to find >> the link. Personally, I think Greg's "relay extra transactions via weak >> blocks" idea [0] from a year ago is an approach that should be considered >> here. [...] > Weak blocks give an advantage to large miners. [..] > Meanwhile large miners do find weak blocks often, making the > feature useful for them and making it even easier for them to profit by > including non-standard transactions. Which again, is something that > small miners can't do. On the one hand it allows big miners to get these non-standard transactions propagated early, so that their actual blocks don't get delayed. On the other hand, as soon as they do that, any other miner can run off with the on chain fees. But that would then encourage out-of-band fees (even more). There's an attribution problem, but although the weak blocks don't end up in the blockchain, they're still pretty good proof that a miner performed the requested service of (at least) spreading the transaction. Perhaps weak blocks are only a good thing if they're linked in a chain, like in p2pool. They might work for individual pools internally (small, well connected?), but not for the global system. - Sjors -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/5E8FF16C-A962-478E-A965-129EBEEB8E28%40sprovoost.nl.