From: Leo Wandersleb <lwandersleb@gmail.com>
To: Bitcoin Development Mailing List <bitcoindev@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] Pre-emptive commit/reveal for quantum-safe migration (poison-pill)
Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2025 10:26:41 -0700 (PDT) [thread overview]
Message-ID: <5e393f57-ac87-40fd-93ef-e1006accdb55n@googlegroups.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <ZmYpRwmVDoJBUhiCRb909Lgwws_dT9d_CNUjfddVt128pyjdH0UcYfXgA_uguwRu44ZC8_x_SwlrooqKhyvdwJjnO1h3BvzQxVRbdCpVfjg=@proton.me>
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Hi conduition,
Thanks for your careful analysis - excellent catches.
You're absolutely right about the txid vulnerability. The commitment must
be to the complete transaction including witness data (wTXID or equivalent)
to prevent an attacker from pre-committing to unsigned transactions. This
is essential - otherwise an attacker could indeed enumerate the UTXO set
and create commitments without knowing the private keys.
Regarding updates: You're correct that frequent updates would be needed as
wallets receive new UTXOs. However, I don't see this as a major issue -
users could batch their commitments periodically (say, monthly) rather than
after every transaction. The scheme is particularly important for existing
UTXOs that already have exposed pubkeys (old P2PK, reused addresses, etc.).
For new UTXOs, wallets should ideally migrate to quantum-safe addresses
once available. OpenTimestamps aggregation would indeed help with scaling
and provide plausible deniability about the number of UTXOs being protected.
The time delay serves a different purpose than you might expect. It's not
about preventing commitment forgery after pubkey exposure, but rather about
allowing priority based on commitment age when multiple parties claim the
same UTXO:
1. Weak announcement starts the 144-block window
2. During this window, anyone with a strong commitment can reveal it
3. The oldest valid commitment wins
This creates the "poison pill" effect: an attacker might crack a key and
try to spend a UTXO, but if the original owner has an older commitment,
they can reclaim it during the window. The uncertainty about which UTXOs
have poison pills makes attacking large "lost" UTXOs risky - hence less
disruptive to the network.
The delay essentially allows a "commitment priority contest" where age
determines the winner, protecting users who prepared early while still
allowing these users to not move their funds.
Best,
Leo
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next prev parent reply other threads:[~2025-06-03 18:29 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 14+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2025-06-02 21:06 [bitcoindev] Pre-emptive commit/reveal for quantum-safe migration (poison-pill) Leo Wandersleb
2025-06-02 23:11 ` Nagaev Boris
2025-06-03 4:19 ` Leo Wandersleb
2025-06-03 11:51 ` Leo Wandersleb
2025-06-03 15:15 ` 'conduition' via Bitcoin Development Mailing List
2025-06-03 17:26 ` Leo Wandersleb [this message]
2025-06-03 19:49 ` Tim Ruffing
2025-06-04 17:14 ` Leo Wandersleb
2025-06-03 21:49 ` Nagaev Boris
2025-06-04 17:39 ` Leo Wandersleb
2025-06-04 18:38 ` Boris Nagaev
2025-06-05 8:18 ` Leo Wandersleb
2025-06-05 14:54 ` Boris Nagaev
2025-06-05 15:01 ` 'conduition' via Bitcoin Development Mailing List
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