From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CEC34C49 for ; Wed, 29 Aug 2018 14:40:18 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-pf1-f172.google.com (mail-pf1-f172.google.com [209.85.210.172]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4ECF97E3 for ; Wed, 29 Aug 2018 14:40:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pf1-f172.google.com with SMTP id h79-v6so2368710pfk.8 for ; Wed, 29 Aug 2018 07:40:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=voskuil-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=OnyXu7BVRogkzr3MgQGapZfkA0ONlqhq1Jl99UerqgQ=; b=KiUG4WV/hdV3oxdRWUc5FVMUrE1bl84pmMNvQhnNE+FhDRdHL3aIZJcTg1+XYuq0rf pockBugRlIDEfhALai94ZPOOx1QPKJoRhDO7//Mgh80NWPToZ+TWQGGXY/CAJ4uTZctR xmbG0lLyelpOdKKgiOMG7lTCTWrgrB3TxK0RK1cdwhzLubUiEvjMxUScijT8sbTqPm+D QINgzRsyidCgvjH6R3LmXzgMp/s2o9H0Zdb6Q89iLs0UHkA7zibmAFcGFw+g5w2qGWKC Nn79tT+h8HmKsFNVkaCwQsf2sveBzK59Yzqjn5/9ETgr+53SCSW3oI2+jdkAHOBu7Fsb DSuw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=OnyXu7BVRogkzr3MgQGapZfkA0ONlqhq1Jl99UerqgQ=; b=VtrD3l6LDdS0wzgxYShE3cxBE1t0ifVUca6fDdiHgGaeV8BT9xYsbsNDXiU0JeK6O8 KFRLMJyB0fvdcv3hMl1osYBnFitv1+2b3YtthChesdPu2l760DSSCrFp7FeUQUVAITZn lOOD84+zxgjL8wJiZci4+deh9ndzJkHqGJQRIcW/+pNfZ+eC0C2lFQ+/1HazpXDsHyHM BYM5vSZgo1bo6mILdVBKQMqhSjQ24uBKZkH5IbNbEqIBTCX6/uXODnqmhKWjDOnh8iJZ h4/2iGIxz5Zh4y8hJGLKAupPtG286LDp0Tc1lPmH8/igNU2WR+KAKSQUDZf3DEEkKTkw 4KPg== X-Gm-Message-State: APzg51DcibF0CREwK2bACCUKVs3zRxVyHqBcdxCkSzBSNdDTICxgaheD TdQbaqQKMYV+pqEXn244KG30ng== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ANB0VdZjk245H6JyrsNmP+T9PiLRJoJUNNdf6UZIv3/4vMN5JFRmdoOXt+ZNsv7C/KkSag24DnLeUA== X-Received: by 2002:a62:9ed1:: with SMTP id f78-v6mr6340225pfk.206.1535553617837; Wed, 29 Aug 2018 07:40:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.0.1.83] (c-67-161-88-73.hsd1.wa.comcast.net. [67.161.88.73]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id o10-v6sm17144288pfk.76.2018.08.29.07.40.16 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 29 Aug 2018 07:40:17 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Eric Voskuil X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15G77) In-Reply-To: <8AE1517F-88FB-479D-AE89-993A5545D210@jonasschnelli.ch> Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2018 07:40:16 -0700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <758E3CA7-295B-4B77-BFF5-9AAE959D53EA@voskuil.org> References: <8AE1517F-88FB-479D-AE89-993A5545D210@jonasschnelli.ch> To: Jonas Schnelli , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 29 Aug 2018 14:46:42 +0000 Cc: Blockchain Group Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Building a Bitcoin API and query system. X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2018 14:40:18 -0000 The API implementation is not what is centralizing, nor is full indexation n= on-scalable. The centralization is in not running the API from a node under y= our own control. This is of course implied by the comment, =E2=80=9Cwithout t= he need for syncing=E2=80=9D. In other words it is the deployment cost of th= e node that is centralizing. Yet if people relied only on bitcoind and never centralized services there w= ould be *no* block explorers (and no secure light wallets), because it does n= ot provide remote query and does not fully index. Block explorers and light wallets are pretty useful, so presumably some API m= ust provide these features (ideally with reduced deployment cost). That will= either be centralized or decentralized services. As such it seems wise to e= ncourage the latter, as opposed to questioning whether there is any valid bl= ock explorer use case. e > On Aug 28, 2018, at 11:36, Jonas Schnelli via bitcoin-dev wrote: >=20 > Hi >=20 > To give a critical viewpoint on a such API: >=20 > Such APIs usually result in central validation, meaning that users trust A= PI services rather the validating their own data. It break some of the funda= mental properties of Bitcoin (avoid trusted third parties). > Systems or applications depending on a full indexed blockchain (a thus suc= h API) do usually scale pretty bad. >=20 > I=E2=80=99d like to hear some concrete use-cases for a such block explorer= (ish) API. >=20 > Thanks > =E2=80=94 > Jonas >=20 >> Am 26.08.2018 um 21:58 schrieb Blockchain Group via bitcoin-dev : >>=20 >> Hello everyone, >>=20 >> I am C++ & Node.js developer. I want to propose making a new Bitcoin API t= hat supports fast quering of Bitcoin blocks and transactions without the nee= d for syncing with all previous nodes. >>=20 >> In a typical case where I want to build a full fleged Bitcoin explorer cu= m wallet system on my end with external APIs, I need to sync my node and the= n query for the information I need to show separately. I am proposing a unif= ied method of finding/quering the blockchain data with a standardized templa= te containing minimal information about the actual mined block or transactio= n yet satify the need of what I want to query. >>=20 >> I am working on making a template and a support mechanism on Node.js. I w= ant to propose it as an improvement (BIP). It will be a great help to future= web developers who want to make something similar. >>=20 >> Thanks >> Sumit Lahiri. >> _______________________________________________ >> bitcoin-dev mailing list >> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org >> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev >=20 > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev