From: Peter R <peter_r@gmx.com>
To: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Defending against empty or near empty blocks from malicious miner takeover?
Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2017 13:28:44 -0700 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <9C2A6867-470D-4336-8439-17F4E0CA4B17@gmx.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <f4849cef-3c40-31a4-e323-6a731bb52bc2@cannon-ciota.info>
One of the purported benefits of a soft-forking change (a tightening of the consensus rule set) is the reduced risk of a blockchain split compared to a loosening of the consensus rule set. The way this works is that miners who fail to upgrade to the new tighter ruleset will have their non-compliant blocks orphaned by the hash power majority. This is a strong incentive to upgrade and has historically worked well. If a minority subset of the network didn’t want to abide by the new restricted rule set, a reasonable solution would be for them to change the proof-of-work and start a spin-off from the existing Bitcoin ledger (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=563972.0).
In the case of the coming network upgrade to larger blocks, a primary concern of both business such as Coinbase and Bitpay, and most miners, is the possibility of a blockchain split and the associated confusion, replay risk, etc. By applying techniques that are known to be successful for soft-forking changes, we can likewise benefit in a way that makes a split less likely as we move towards larger blocks. Two proposed techniques to reduce the chances of a split are:
1. That miners begin to orphan the blocks of non-upgraded miners once a super-majority of the network hash power has upgraded. This would serve as an expensive-to-ignore reminder to upgrade.
2. That, in the case where a minority branch emerges (unlikely IMO), majority miners would continually re-org that minority branch with empty blocks to prevent transactions from confirming, thereby eliminating replay risk.
Just like after a soft forking change, a minority that does not want to abide by the current ruleset enforced by the majority could change the proof-of-work and start a spin-off from the existing Bitcoin ledger, as suggested by Emin.
Best regards,
Peter R
> On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:12 AM, CANNON via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
> On 03/24/2017 07:00 PM, Aymeric Vitte wrote:
>> I don't know what "Time is running short I fear" stands for and when 50%
>> is supposed to be reached
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA512
>
> On 03/24/2017 07:00 PM, Aymeric Vitte wrote: > I don't know what
> "Time is running short I fear" stands for and when 50% > is supposed
> to be reached
>
> According to current hashrate distribution tracking site coin.dance,
> very likely within less than four weeks according to current hashrate
> takeover rate.
>
> While a fork is very likely, that I dont really fear because worst
> case scenario is that bitcoin still survives and the invalid chain
> becomes an alt. My fear is the centralized mining power being used
> to attack the valid chain with intentions on killing it. [1]
>
> Shouldn't this 50% attack they are threatening be a concern? If it
> is a concern, what options are on the table. If it is not a concern
> please enlightent me as to why.
>
>
> [1] Source:
> https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/6172s3/peter_rizun_tells_miners_to_force_a_hard_fork_by/
>
> Text:
>
> The attack quoted from his article:
> https://medium.com/@peter_r/on-the-emerging-consensus-regarding-bitcoins-block-size-limit-insights-from-my-visit-with-2348878a16d8
>
> [Level 2] Anti-split protection Miners will orphan the
> blocks of non-compliant miners prior to the first larger block
> to serve as a reminder to upgrade. Simply due to the possibility
> of having blocks orphaned, all miners would be motivated to
> begin signalling for larger blocks once support definitively
> passes 51%. If some miners hold out (e.g., they may not be
> paying attention regarding the upgrade), then they will begin
> to pay attention after losing approximately $15,000 of revenue
> due to an orphaned block.
>
> [Level 3] Anti-split protection In the scenario where Levels
> 1 and 2 protection fails to entice all non-compliant miners to
> upgrade, a small-block minority chain may emerge. To address the
> risk of coins being spent on this chain (replay risk), majority
> miners will deploy hash power as needed to ensure the minority
> chain includes only empty blocks after the forking point. This
> can easily be accomplished if the majority miners maintain a
> secret chain of empty blocks built off their last empty
> block publishing only as much of this chain as necessary
> to orphan any non-empty blocks produced on the minority chain.
>
>
>
>
> - --
> Cannon
> PGP Fingerprint: 2BB5 15CD 66E7 4E28 45DC 6494 A5A2 2879 3F06 E832
> Email: cannon@cannon-ciota.info
>
> NOTICE: ALL EMAIL CORRESPONDENCE NOT SIGNED/ENCRYPTED WITH PGP SHOULD
> BE CONSIDERED POTENTIALLY FORGED, AND NOT PRIVATE.
> If this matters to you, use PGP.
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJY1pbaAAoJEAYDai9lH2mwOO0QANOWqGzPNlifWguc+Y5UQxQM
> eAiztAayQBoAyLcFE7/qdtSNlUxbIAHG17fM+aNkehjYH2oN5ODJ+j7E2Yt6EoUH
> h5t8MLhNRG/YGF1hJK8Io940EmdcjuNmohiZvrjIqEOYggmLU3hR6J4gsuGsQQhu
> gY3sMS/TtT+gZNH8w53ePGrsVhuQR7yEMMr91/vM4+Q5abpwqLeYLnslaZDcd3XK
> VB9vyyK08r34J1GQt/H4UvTvGs28MFKBkvueA/Sfyvnrih7+WSQLuSvhiFr+cW1B
> TmSVYrB2DzyHN27jDCI2ty3ryNE4PMYcaeLfI2TTbsD/MuVU5lK0kM/1JajP4eRj
> j+P03OipuQiy/dNU63w0Uka2PbdKhDC13hVtK/ttBbNppbjnGeB9PYSJCzOpInGw
> NwAyz0rVS/llGsdctcII7Z6AUMGuJXzsosY8vjUroU+KFRDqIbDfC53sH7DaPh7u
> YawwId5S5RnZsAGCUJ+qNcg0s728J1eDjofN291IS5sOKMzpI7KhaOhFxjnk1MpN
> ZAlQeTlvG+sAdn61QMQK1NbFt0km+jcqyVh0+L01yB0K4VDi1YFJaSBOaYUELBXa
> 8a6WhZf5nrl5UIpH7rRcPzzqchcdYczy5VRZp2UsU+HYeqLXlcN0a03yPpVQik9S
> /T93MuZgmvSCry5MlccA
> =R71g
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2017-03-25 20:33 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 22+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2017-03-24 16:03 [bitcoin-dev] Defending against empty or near empty blocks from malicious miner takeover? CANNON
2017-03-24 16:27 ` Emin Gün Sirer
2017-04-14 2:22 ` CANNON
2017-03-24 17:29 ` Nick ODell
2017-03-24 17:37 ` Hampus Sjöberg
2017-03-24 19:00 ` Aymeric Vitte
2017-03-25 16:12 ` CANNON
2017-03-25 20:28 ` Peter R [this message]
2017-03-26 2:38 ` Alex Morcos
2017-03-26 9:13 ` Chris Pacia
2017-03-26 11:27 ` Alex Morcos
2017-03-26 19:05 ` Peter R
2017-03-26 20:20 ` Alphonse Pace
2017-03-26 20:22 ` Bryan Bishop
2017-03-26 20:37 ` Trevin Hofmann
2017-03-26 20:44 ` Bryan Bishop
2017-03-26 21:12 ` Eric Voskuil
2017-03-26 21:42 ` Tom Harding
2017-03-26 22:15 ` Eric Voskuil
2017-03-27 10:25 ` Aymeric Vitte
2017-03-26 3:00 ` [bitcoin-dev] Two altcoins and a 51% attack (was: Defending against empty or near empty blocks from malicious miner takeover?) Eric Voskuil
2017-03-24 19:00 ` [bitcoin-dev] Defending against empty or near empty blocks from malicious miner takeover? Aymeric Vitte
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to=9C2A6867-470D-4336-8439-17F4E0CA4B17@gmx.com \
--to=peter_r@gmx.com \
--cc=bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox