From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org (smtp4.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::137]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D453C002D for ; Sat, 9 Jul 2022 20:54:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53C3C415DE for ; Sat, 9 Jul 2022 20:54:01 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp4.osuosl.org 53C3C415DE Authentication-Results: smtp4.osuosl.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=voskuil-org.20210112.gappssmtp.com header.i=@voskuil-org.20210112.gappssmtp.com header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=20210112 header.b=Ka1iUR+O X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp4.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7e2DJC8mbqw4 for ; Sat, 9 Jul 2022 20:54:00 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp4.osuosl.org 0C980415BE Received: from mail-pg1-x52d.google.com (mail-pg1-x52d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::52d]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0C980415BE for ; Sat, 9 Jul 2022 20:53:59 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pg1-x52d.google.com with SMTP id 145so1692909pga.12 for ; Sat, 09 Jul 2022 13:53:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=voskuil-org.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version:subject:message-id:date :cc:to; bh=ozFANWuAydR45E85Tgjg8Cmsx66RsRpdfkS7g9VuVsU=; b=Ka1iUR+OL3S0sJVSEhq5YRyXgx339fTtTQMYlSrmCzx5DIGuI9LoiIaA0pqJk7bkf3 q5lXKlBLYpBoEVLs/dh2fnWpbAH2W+gHzK/2j4eqwhUdSPShaHeuI6y9l6m9oWTIq7lZ GW6OBAn8+bOMpjmXq8wqpTa2U0FmqC/svvOYJQhnnj5Qz40ETw3O87tLN6JRgtd9xy/n kFpUx1fVnykkCotXloOCXrpF/ApwP5aJI7dTsR7tSGGwyAd19QK6FFKBkLkK/Keo/w8a FUwGoDzdm+jn/BpfWogPnW9wQe+BE+OiMPlrs4EWeYXNlLw5uYaiNAcpEIoY+uzjzv9w ELSA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version :subject:message-id:date:cc:to; bh=ozFANWuAydR45E85Tgjg8Cmsx66RsRpdfkS7g9VuVsU=; b=0UaiceZMcfrGofvzTDXujBDR/4vb+fGitun+b6BpEqT/TEaMipahQeAApo6CFCYGh+ PiK+aVF+3AhFELHMXgllzs2SsSc43150BzGWBuzk9Ha6fJVYyKNZAfvv5WBbPysVjrWG wND9r6LGC3O3QmPmiwka7SxNlF3mZ/D2oKgMWefHshwSOl+n7z9xYTbBravwxcjfVf/P UaCSEp0zCIJJs1ydfOfY+KAKMtmrwFcSkFFuDwgMkYegaEiB3cbu5sRg+R0k6WBIZ0RE 6sANK0DVcbvQ0PspjPjMqsQP7QP+XmGJCrw7lhoZS0qfNl7bbB1vTB23W+UBxYVl9Fs7 D84Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora9820k2/26AF4aGspZ1KC+YSfgBLcg/G4jhyV6YrfK8hRDpg4HF BlCmE+Ejddb3MdOL3tM2Zj8YJVLxIPj6YQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1vskAkRBQP7d8RtqsypPHAVeFwzKA/GKInXhHpqnr027ujZ3lk4+M4Q1/RMAmmACwDP/DLPZA== X-Received: by 2002:a63:78ce:0:b0:40c:3c04:e3d8 with SMTP id t197-20020a6378ce000000b0040c3c04e3d8mr9051587pgc.202.1657400038876; Sat, 09 Jul 2022 13:53:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtpclient.apple ([2600:380:7042:731b:b459:b441:974c:2171]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id v34-20020a631522000000b0040c52ff0ba9sm1543263pgl.37.2022.07.09.13.53.58 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 09 Jul 2022 13:53:58 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Eric Voskuil Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Message-Id: Date: Sat, 9 Jul 2022 13:53:56 -0700 To: Peter Todd X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (19F77) Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Subject: [bitcoin-dev] Surprisingly, Tail Emission Is Not Inflationary X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 09 Jul 2022 20:54:01 -0000 =EF=BB=BFIn Bitcoin we use the term =E2=80=9Csupply=E2=80=9C as a reference t= o the number of coins minted. This colloquialism is commonly conflated with t= he economic concept of supply, and then injected into a supply/demand relati= on as if it had the same applicability. Economically supply refers to desire= to sell, while demand refers to desire to buy. e > On Jul 9, 2022, at 08:24, Eric Voskuil wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFTo clarify, price inflation is not caused by market production. A= ttributing the observed lack of inflation (eg fee %) to loss is an assumed r= elation. >=20 > Even if the amount of loss was known (which it is not), there remains an a= ssumption in the correlation of non-lost coins to price. Demand determines p= rice, not the amount of something in existence, hence the folly of S2F (1/mo= netary-inflation). >=20 > e >=20 >> On Jul 9, 2022, at 08:15, Peter Todd wrote: >> =EF=BB=BFOn Sat, Jul 09, 2022 at 07:26:22AM -0700, Eric Voskuil wrote: >>>> Due to lost coins, a tail emission/fixed reward actually results in a s= table money supply. Not an (monetarily) inflationary supply. >>> This observation is not a proof of lost coins, that is an assumption. >> To be clear, are you claiming that there is no proof that coins are lost?= >> -- >> https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org