From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 267AEDD4 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2018 15:29:33 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-lf0-f42.google.com (mail-lf0-f42.google.com [209.85.215.42]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1F926203 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2018 15:29:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-lf0-f42.google.com with SMTP id w23so7563834lfd.11 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2018 07:29:31 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=organicdesign-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=vDDgd3WlYh8ZLDH0AglQlHL2sAtbvG+/vY74yHqI8Ms=; b=nbU2yw65BvJR1t1QOLu5GyaToPQsukouwtGDUxeBU/CDJmqcE+7fIQyLlh9gZFmO3f CWgvv4znK9odsQsn0c6onL4sEg7po0/FPW0ptll73i/M/4g5ncV5A6Z4Co5YnBlEFK/g JO3/sTzynoOxa59JNiWopXAsnBPKJ+m3TMyA0jZKozgCog+nXDfndqCk0mA0mncFu4T2 tZmBQPBrGnFGCx1TudhlMRmeCieMSb4fgbZMuBK06EAnzDpvi+d/vnGAY+mwo3mnVTvX HGf5O8fK0u3nf3o5XCt2ZRZ6t2FSfL8WQrO4n4fiRLmdM93qImCET/hvAY98//E00/rD kf2w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=vDDgd3WlYh8ZLDH0AglQlHL2sAtbvG+/vY74yHqI8Ms=; b=qC/3432gF/DTLe2buVMC3XRW8cOrM6pkxDl22gbr+GyDz8VXoWL300A0wfcoqR1vAF PppmD+P4vCIj7rJsy+9KBdztyagFIGUO7SW5xJ1jlZB82dwf3NZOx34B+Qd5Gr4eW5AG dvP3tiGICusKNJ+J8bT1AtR4dZ4kl2Kn9ZdHvUWohMc4DOXBqvKA5WcZfxtnwJ70z7jL LZYeaVL8KNoUFh4xso82syuwMmiFtjAu2wHiSwbLzjA998RhVZR6ZxZUSsySY+6Vx35M o4cM9VVVJyzeld4v3DEGvnKVM1s7quwHn5F2RaiBNXR0FSOGVPv8s8UMokEPiCCMMRst GQrQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AKwxytcreDTtBE1b/pRN6jrlaegEQVy+L22JndpL27CBLYBFhi49NZuV TYcsXlLSsprwI4g5k39A6rc6jqhC X-Google-Smtp-Source: AH8x224c9/EWvhq/U5bYPBDGUvRRjoe3BAngVxUFzrR1+Ra4QNNOvDXmFPICBfDm6tNnTSFqw7F/Bw== X-Received: by 10.25.224.17 with SMTP id x17mr1905753lfg.91.1516548569735; Sun, 21 Jan 2018 07:29:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lf0-f47.google.com (mail-lf0-f47.google.com. [209.85.215.47]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r84sm1513582lff.72.2018.01.21.07.29.27 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 21 Jan 2018 07:29:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lf0-f47.google.com with SMTP id q194so7551962lfe.13 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2018 07:29:27 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.46.66.5 with SMTP id p5mr2225985lja.3.1516548567350; Sun, 21 Jan 2018 07:29:27 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.25.39.147 with HTTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2018 07:29:26 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <58fa85b8-cba3-ee34-8c96-41c6c7bfbf9c@gmail.com> From: Glen Peterson Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2018 10:29:26 -0500 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: To: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 21 Jan 2018 15:36:25 +0000 Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Upgrading PoW algorithm X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2018 15:29:33 -0000 Popular hashing algorithms have historically managed 10-15 years of intense use before flaws are found in the algorithm. This chart suggests SHA-256 is already aging: http://valerieaurora.org/hash.html If history is any guide, any long-term cryptocurrency/blockchain will need the cryptography updated every decade or so. On Sat, Jan 20, 2018 at 1:36 PM, Melvin Carvalho via bitcoin-dev wrote: > > > On 17 January 2018 at 23:31, Jefferson Carpenter via bitcoin-dev > wrote: >> >> Bitcoin's difficulty will be maxed out within about 400 years, by Moore's >> law. (After that - supposing the software does not crash when difficulty >> overflows - block time will start decreasing, and it will not take long >> before blocks are mined faster than photons can be sent across the planet). >> >> Bitcoin is the dominant cryptocurrency today, as the first mover: the >> perfectly fair worldwide game of inventing the cryptocurrency has been >> played and won. However, unfortunately, it has a built-in end date: about >> 400 years from now. After that, it won't necessarily be clear what the >> dominant cryptocurrency is. It might be a lot like VHS vs Betamax, and a >> lot of people could lose a lot of money. It seems to me, this could be >> mitigated by planning today for what we are going to do when Bitcoin finally >> breaks 400 years from now. >> >> Are there any distinct plans today for migrating to a PoW supporting an >> even higher difficulty? > > > Crypto algorithms have a lifetime, and consensus is no different. > > Is it likely to be more than a few years? Yes. > > Is likely to be less than a few hundred years. Yes. > > Every algorithm involves trade offs and it's the job of a thoughtful dev > team to examine those trade offs and come to a consensus optimal solution. > > This field is only 9 years old, and there is a large amount of R & D in this > area. So we can evaluate what seems to working better and what seems to be > working worse, transfer that to BIPs, create code, test it, try to achieve > consensus. The normal path that has served free software projects well. > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> bitcoin-dev mailing list >> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org >> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > > > > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > -- Glen K. Peterson (828) 393-0081