From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org (smtp4.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::137]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31DA0C002D for ; Sat, 9 Jul 2022 17:41:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB18042164 for ; Sat, 9 Jul 2022 17:41:27 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp4.osuosl.org EB18042164 Authentication-Results: smtp4.osuosl.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=20210112 header.b=RcyYMItN X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp4.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id c9qCp2bI8zzK for ; Sat, 9 Jul 2022 17:41:26 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp4.osuosl.org 72E7D41BE8 Received: from mail-yw1-x112b.google.com (mail-yw1-x112b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::112b]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 72E7D41BE8 for ; Sat, 9 Jul 2022 17:41:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-yw1-x112b.google.com with SMTP id 00721157ae682-31c89653790so14272357b3.13 for ; Sat, 09 Jul 2022 10:41:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=4PAq4ft8W9ulTt953o4sTSC91PTJbs44R/CiCj3mE4c=; b=RcyYMItNRSKL1rcyt+rchjeHMbJ66nXDmc6n4uYAL7G6RhdCaCVLuUKqKs4ZQACbcR FXsfpkxY950lR95h0FtsvFJctLACPLcpaCsdiMHB+cDoS84UfDvR06kshFmRiaeAJsx5 I1BeI+WxsW9dMLjflSlM85sTu70LRvlxjP5ECej/hOcRAu/Bg+dl6Wtfuyf2P8qMDdYI 0anxGe8HXdZUCB49MSRsQpafUk/IMp9fR3DuEGafS4tFGFKjaVRwwwgav87aa4/oXSt1 eWJ19/9tHnW5zENTMITtKGyK7UZJwD23z4VY0MWkY0297lwXIQvEuZP9+AB0kiCJH/MA wXkg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=4PAq4ft8W9ulTt953o4sTSC91PTJbs44R/CiCj3mE4c=; b=gsQeh04bTmXjWGEXl8EldjaMezfg6v2qLNRa+7W6An/M8RZeG2mmI7rDvO9TVYe7Cw iUNdQmJ3w98++pyLYVvQrrXbVih7U24HTkx0cl5tFY5Dc8f+Lb207KxIp6QcIe2JZfJi VMwCTtAYhmgcx8h5eOLe4sYCUvssB/nyO8mrMS2FLMFcEsnp7kshdk89zIpoLThnx0Gq qDK+JqktpUUE0kmNv/q4uxAxGgnc+2PpU2ZGZ++bXajbyOsH773h4BO3UufNVqL5QwgY cbDfwxxxjKhTE/JOgrJ40sp8cWOuM+jrmLOkqjXM9p/+dOnYufCh4ZanP505sodycQu/ Nc9A== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora8ctwmTBhWi5LViJJ3/r9gndXh4hR5KKZ53FfORGhmZF9O2A4jN JnU6k67wPy1g685j/PTIgzhxTROuVJNoioUTcaTWPAo8KK8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1tC15+i8Yb0e5ED01506RPc0q02asFX2Gn3A5aHhxTMcEzoRlgBY1vWdKS47V8W/DcRpJ7zLVTYAOHgpmvCdzA= X-Received: by 2002:a0d:d001:0:b0:31c:75bc:25bd with SMTP id s1-20020a0dd001000000b0031c75bc25bdmr10741122ywd.505.1657388485259; Sat, 09 Jul 2022 10:41:25 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: naman naman Date: Sat, 9 Jul 2022 21:43:49 +0400 Message-ID: To: Peter Todd , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000eb38d205e362d313" X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 09 Jul 2022 17:47:57 +0000 Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Surprisingly, Tail Emission Is Not Inflationary X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 09 Jul 2022 17:41:28 -0000 --000000000000eb38d205e362d313 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi, This approach raises the obvious question : If someone hasn't had access to their coins in a long time (yrs, decades, however you want to define it) - and they wish to access/move them after such a time - isn't your proposal simply taking away their ability to do so? Some might call it : stealing their coins. How does one conclusively prove that "lost" coins are "lost forever"? Regards, thenoblebot On Sat, 9 Jul, 2022, 7:31 pm Peter Todd via bitcoin-dev, < bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > On Sat, Jul 09, 2022 at 08:24:51AM -0700, Eric Voskuil wrote: > > To clarify, price inflation is not caused by market production. > Attributing the observed lack of inflation (eg fee %) to loss is an assumed > relation. > > My article is a mathematical proof that has nothing to do with > observations of > inflation. > > What I did is prove that if there is tail emission/fixed supply, the coin > supply will converge towards a fixed amount because the coin supply > dependant > rate of coin loss balances out the fixed rate of coin production. > > That proof has nothing to do with market dynamics and would happen in any > system, economic or not, with similar underlying dynamics. > > -- > https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > --000000000000eb38d205e362d313 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,=C2=A0

Th= is approach raises the obvious=C2=A0question : If someone hasn't had ac= cess to their coins in a=C2=A0long time (yrs, decades, however you want to = define it) - and they wish to access/move them after such a time - isn'= t your proposal simply taking away their ability to do so? Some might call = it : stealing their coins.

How= does one conclusively prove that "lost" coins are "lost for= ever"?

Regards,=C2= =A0
thenoblebot

On Sat, 9 Jul, 2022, 7:31= pm Peter Todd via bitcoin-dev, <bitcoin-dev@lists.li= nuxfoundation.org> wrote:
On= Sat, Jul 09, 2022 at 08:24:51AM -0700, Eric Voskuil wrote:
> To clarify, price inflation is not caused by market production. Attrib= uting the observed lack of inflation (eg fee %) to loss is an assumed relat= ion.

My article is a mathematical proof that has nothing to do with observations= of
inflation.

What I did is prove that if there is tail emission/fixed supply, the coin supply will converge towards a fixed amount because the coin supply dependa= nt
rate of coin loss balances out the fixed rate of coin production.

That proof has nothing to do with market dynamics and would happen in any system, economic or not, with similar underlying dynamics.

--
https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org
_______________________________________________
bitcoin-dev mailing list
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
https://lists.li= nuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
--000000000000eb38d205e362d313--