From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org (smtp1.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::138]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 445E4C0001 for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 05:46:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C78183DF6 for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 05:46:08 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.088 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.088 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_KAM_HTML_FONT_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: smtp1.osuosl.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp1.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rgCBT9luwZZy for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 05:46:06 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 Received: from mail-yb1-xb2a.google.com (mail-yb1-xb2a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b2a]) by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B009083DE4 for ; Sun, 14 Mar 2021 05:46:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-yb1-xb2a.google.com with SMTP id c131so29824874ybf.7 for ; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 21:46:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=XhzzQQpIoLhNw5ibKKiJuqVVI3qoTtt9rnPXmbIPSWo=; b=Qe4W65wO9XrZLlEuqIGbTdg8nFYRA8V7JabW2IGyK/L07FnBe1AkdNOG1EuQwI7pQQ R6N8QRUjS29F8/hX0Ai+iv9IYP8ddhI4/KdQZQzP3FuuKLAsPr3n2V/sD1M9Z633ha3f zEKZnVfoAfg+k4ezgEt4XF1K3uM/owaf2PKsXqANB7pgh1a8d6AJsk+2D0KioZf/JT5o 7g9mF1Klaw/cieeMvrBvJLLfc/7nCP70e+NE76yD5cqLd2eqT0tGjEDbMP4/e89ERu7B Y9nUjLmTSkx3FmAXo0TsWRX4D1R3OUfS2l62Yomy6+wsGqHuGzLOWU06mZW8d5D4ofKx AVCA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=XhzzQQpIoLhNw5ibKKiJuqVVI3qoTtt9rnPXmbIPSWo=; b=ZaXYjQx1CSc4kCYK7omwj4HoIHMZnI8z7gMpwacB0g/7bCq/ajpPmdB+Y904+BJtri jwykXVRIA0AiHM9xE1Rp73Gue/704E8Ki23djRK6sRgDyYn36xDApSK38xsdkLmRsOWl UX7xjvvw7Ji/jKu8BnH2tf2b4EQND4W9mfN21ypa2gSugQFlBBtCEmxC6FSbfVbG4f1v NP/tQg6qd5VcoYksYyOUaTC3jvU1+dx3gBvC+fmQQ2BimPkT2i4n4Wc2OGi2IGs014O1 8IdnqSt9EoYgAQB9xyGC3m7tZ5k6n7v2y1GCopaME4Y1OtKFN71GED7JmvIzIyrDi8XK 2EYg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532HKFW8sMQSZ4Xha/C7gbMjmLu70RsjWqfgWe+e+3ov2bETT8Z5 5166MDCyb/6hwpnlzawOIhrOwYqbUyEgj0p5sQusGM6YXE4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxJmdev1w9sTJkJUjbXAwcQDRla0KsKaEghyI+lWNcHs3oybHYRgzuDtA8nYGwmUQK3ydIEzJAc1zY+cxPc8Uk= X-Received: by 2002:a25:a246:: with SMTP id b64mr28790224ybi.236.1615700765379; Sat, 13 Mar 2021 21:46:05 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <296-604d1600-db-42a1fb80@93437088> In-Reply-To: <296-604d1600-db-42a1fb80@93437088> From: Lonero Foundation Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 00:45:53 -0500 Message-ID: To: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002f0f4605bd78a620" X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 13:40:47 +0000 Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] BIP Proposal: Consensus (hard fork) PoST Datastore for Energy Efficient Mining X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 05:46:08 -0000 --0000000000002f0f4605bd78a620 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have added quite a bit more details. I haven't made any UML diagrams just yet. I did add a basic non-technical infographic though, and more then likely making a technical UML for the cryptographic mechanisms will be on my to-do list. I have also updated the terminology and added a bit more content. Best regards, Andrew On Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 2:44 PM email@yancy.lol wrote: > My mistake for thinking your text was generated text, and my humor was no= t > meant to be directed at you, so apologies if you took it personally. > > > PS: The AI overlord is no joke > > Cheers, > -Yancy > > On Saturday, March 13, 2021 18:11 CET, Lonero Foundation < > loneroassociation@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hi, no worries. I made the changes now in the GitHub repository and pull > request. I'm hoping for a BIP # soon. Thanks for the feedback, and I gues= s > the sense of humor. > > Best regards, Andrew > > On Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 10:45 AM yancy wrote: > >> Ok thanks. Using the correct terminology helps people understand what >> you're talking about and take you seriously. >> >> Cheers, >> -Yancy >> >> >> Mar 13, 2021 4:02:18 PM Lonero Foundation : >> >> Hi, I know the differences between the cryptographic hashing algorithm >> and key validation. I know hashing is for SHA, but was referring to asym= metric >> cryptography in regards to the key validation. I should have used a >> different term though instead of, "In regards to cryptographic hashing,"= , I >> should have stated in regards to cryptographic key validation. There are= a >> few other dubious clarifications or minor edits I should make in order t= o >> not draw confusion. I will do a repo update today. Honest mistake, but >> enough with the sarcasm. >> >> Best regards, Andrew >> >> On Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 3:13 AM email@yancy.lol wrote: >> >>> My email was not intended as an insult. Your proposal seemed a bit lik= e >>> gibberish and made some obvious mistakes as pointed out before (such as >>> conflating secp256k1 with sha256), and so I was genuinely curious if yo= u >>> were a bot spamming the list. >>> >>> >>> Maybe a more interesting topic is, can GPT3 be used to generate a BIP? >>> How long before our AI overlord produces improvements to Bitcoin? At w= hat >>> point will the AI have more than 51% of commit frequency? Will we have >>> lost the war to our new centralized overlord? >>> >>> Cheers, >>> -Yancy >>> >>> >>> On Saturday, March 13, 2021 00:31 CET, Lonero Foundation < >>> loneroassociation@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Also, I already stated I was referring to signature validation >>> cryptography in that aspect: >>> https://wizardforcel.gitbooks.io/practical-cryptography-for-developers-= book/content/digital-signatures/ecdsa-sign-verify-examples.html >>> My BIP has a primary purpose in regards to what I want to develop proof= s >>> for and the different cryptographic elements I want to develop proofs f= or. >>> That said to those who disagree with the premise, I do prefer >>> constructive feedback over insults or making fun of one another. After = all >>> this is an improvement proposal with a specific purpose aiming to devel= op a >>> specific thing, not a guy who is just wanting to copy and paste a >>> repository and call it a day. >>> >>> Best regards, Andrew >>> >>> On Fri, Mar 12, 2021 at 6:21 PM Lonero Foundation < >>> loneroassociation@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, I also want to emphasize that my main point isn't just to create a >>>> BTC hardfork or become another Bitcoin Cash, Gold, or SV. The main poi= nt in >>>> regards to this BIP actually expands POW rather than replaces or creat= es an >>>> alternative. Many of the problems faced in regards to security in the >>>> future as well as sustainability is something I believe lots of the ch= anges >>>> I am proposing can fix. In regards to technological implementation, on= ce >>>> this is assigned draft status I am more than willing to create preprin= ts >>>> explaining the cryptography, hashing algorithm improvements, and conse= nsus >>>> that I am working on. This is a highly technologically complex idea th= at I >>>> am willing to "call my bluff on" and expand upon. As for it being a dr= aft, >>>> I think this is a good starting point at least for draft status prior = to >>>> working on technological implementation. >>>> >>>> Best regards, Andrew >>>> >>>> On Fri, Mar 12, 2021 at 5:37 PM email@yancy.lol >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I think Andrew himself is an algo. The crypto training set must not >>>>> be very good. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> -Yancy >>>>> >>>>> On Friday, March 12, 2021 17:54 CET, Lonero Foundation via bitcoin-de= v >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> =E2=80=A6 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > > > --0000000000002f0f4605bd78a620 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I have added quite a bit more details. I haven't made= any UML diagrams just yet. I did add a basic non-technical infographic tho= ugh, and more then likely making a technical UML for the cryptographic mech= anisms will be on my to-do list. I have also updated the terminology and ad= ded a bit more content.

Best r= egards, Andrew

On Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 2:44 PM email@yancy.lol <email= @yancy.lol> wrote:

My mistake for thinking your tex= t was generated text, and my humor was not meant to be directed at you, so = apologies if you took it personally.

=C2=A0

PS: The AI overlord is no joke


Ch= eers,
-Yancy

On Saturday, March 13, 2021 18:11 CET, Lonero Founda= tion <loneroassociation@gmail.com> wrote:
=C2=A0
Hi, no worries. I made the= changes now in the GitHub repository and pull request. I'm hoping for = a BIP # soon. Thanks for the feedback, and I guess the sense of humor.
=C2=A0
Best regards, Andrew
= =C2=A0
On S= at, Mar 13, 2021, 10:45 AM yancy <email@yancy.lol> wrote:
Ok tha= nks.=C2=A0 Using the correct terminology helps people understand what you&#= 39;re talking about and take you seriously.

Cheers,
-Yancy
=C2=A0

Mar 13, 2021 4:02:18 PM Lonero Foundation &l= t;loneroassociation@gmail.com>:

<= div dir=3D"auto">Hi, I know the differences between the cryptographic hashi= ng algorithm and key validation. I know hashing is for SHA, but was referri= ng to=C2=A0asymmetric cryptography in regards to the key validation. = I should have used a different term though instead of, "In regards to = cryptographic hashing,", I should have stated in regards to cryptograp= hic key validation. There are a few other dubious clarifications or minor e= dits I should make in order to not draw confusion. I will do a repo update = today. Honest mistake, but enough with the sarcasm.
=C2=A0
Best regards, Andrew
=C2=A0
On Sat, Mar 13, = 2021, 3:13 AM email@yancy.lol <email@yancy.lol> wrote:

My email was not intended as an insult.=C2=A0 Your= proposal seemed a bit like gibberish and made some obvious mistakes as poi= nted out before (such as conflating secp256k1 with sha256), and so I was ge= nuinely curious if you were a bot spamming the list.

=C2=A0

Maybe a more interesting topic is= , can GPT3 be used to generate a BIP?=C2=A0 How long before our AI overlord= produces improvements to Bitcoin?=C2=A0 At what point will the AI have mor= e than 51% of commit frequency?=C2=A0 Will we have lost the war to our new = centralized overlord?


Cheers,
-Yancy


On Saturda= y, March 13, 2021 00:31 CET, Lonero Foundation <lo= neroassociation@gmail.com> wrote:
=C2=A0
Also, I already stated I was referring to si= gnature validation cryptography in that aspect: https://wizardforcel.gitbooks.io/practical-cryptography= -for-developers-book/content/digital-signatures/ecdsa-sign-verify-examples.= html
My BIP has a primary purpose in regards to what I want t= o develop proofs for and the different cryptographic elements I want to dev= elop proofs for.
That said to those who disagree with the premise= , I do prefer constructive feedback over insults or making fun of one anoth= er. After all this is an improvement proposal with a specific purpose aimin= g to develop a specific thing, not a guy who is just wanting to copy and pa= ste a repository and call it a day.
=C2=A0
Best regards= , Andrew
=C2=A0
On Fri, Mar 12, 2021 at 6:21 PM Lonero Foundation <loneroassociation@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I also wa= nt to emphasize that my main point isn't just to create a BTC hardfork = or become another Bitcoin Cash, Gold, or SV. The main point in regards to t= his BIP actually expands POW rather than replaces or creates an alternative= . Many of the problems faced in regards to security in the future as well a= s sustainability is something I believe lots of the changes I am proposing = can fix. In regards to technological implementation, once this is assigned = draft status I am more than willing to create preprints explaining the cryp= tography, hashing algorithm improvements, and consensus that I am working o= n. This is a highly technologically complex idea that I am willing to "= ;call my bluff on" and expand upon. As for it being a draft, I think t= his is a good starting point at least for draft status prior to working on = technological implementation.
=C2=A0
Best regards, Andr= ew
=C2=A0
On Fri, Mar 12, 2021 at 5:37 PM email@yancy.lol <email@yancy.l= ol> wrote:
I thin= k Andrew himself is an algo.=C2=A0 The crypto training set must not be very= good.

Cheers,
-Yancy

On Friday, March 12, 2021 17:54 CET,= Lonero Foundation via bitcoin-dev <bitc= oin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
=C2=A0
=E2=80=A6



=C2=A0



=C2=A0



=C2=A0 --0000000000002f0f4605bd78a620--