From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 977FE8B4 for ; Thu, 6 Aug 2015 16:11:42 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-io0-f173.google.com (mail-io0-f173.google.com [209.85.223.173]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DE821A6 for ; Thu, 6 Aug 2015 16:11:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: by iodb91 with SMTP id b91so26040184iod.1 for ; Thu, 06 Aug 2015 09:11:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=vinumeris.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=t54allgJlgpr9UfbP5/wORZ1AHlXjseRDqkbfFcCq/4=; b=LCJ3RKCSL12TZrdrewNUNHTjvKxJMWNM/B0KOZb3yJLcdk3xj9tncOZ5yfLPys68O4 dkeDsZ5quWXGhEiyhauu0snE46eEWVKFJn7bcpBsUFtXgXkHFTv+7DCMm8DAplinE4Ti VvS04g1sLver/uyvkj1q52WEYA74LylMgPoto= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=t54allgJlgpr9UfbP5/wORZ1AHlXjseRDqkbfFcCq/4=; b=S+V31CwG/0ae9yi9P9FFnEuG95EWXXG60RsRyrPTUHVCQDJSov1colH0wxOok3zWFc rIaIzUPRFsc+uWCF7unTFV6/S0+yaX2NryASmzGeX+O27UeKNYAvXzX7Beh7BwslicUH gOWy2JjGUCK14YzWTwLKPiy+aes9FuPP8753qp6vV4Dh4vHwAKhbp1deaVPeMN6p9Mf4 fS+8LkR1hpTuY81eyYZ55+QPt1d8v6qVv1ChCkKF6vc+OPOoWp51Q52y2I7ZzNZUElwS ZvQ5cXJiRxT+cGHoEsYCkSeH6869ttp1imX3NxQF3fobIRHr1ChmM+rv7OZ8miQA5Ph6 oIeQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnjRLuVGY+1qD3MqoH7PqAlawG4AUN7xrFs+cY4808NcX+/ayueUkJJulX2JuUAwFIxpg9y MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.107.36.134 with SMTP id k128mr3260778iok.113.1438877501369; Thu, 06 Aug 2015 09:11:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.50.108.111 with HTTP; Thu, 6 Aug 2015 09:11:40 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 6 Aug 2015 18:11:40 +0200 Message-ID: From: Mike Hearn To: Gavin Andresen Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1140ebae585238051ca6c61d X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,HTML_MESSAGE,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org Cc: Bitcoin Dev Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Block size following technological growth X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Aug 2015 16:11:42 -0000 --001a1140ebae585238051ca6c61d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Whilst 1mb to 8mb might seem irrelevant from a pure computer science perspective payment demand is not really infinite, at least not if by "payment" we mean something resembling how current Bitcoin users use the network. If we define "payment" to mean the kind of thing that Bitcoin users and enthusiasts have been doing up until now, then suddenly 1mb to 8mb makes a ton of sense and doesn't really seem that small: we'd have to increase usage by nearly an order of magnitude before it becomes an issue again! If we think of Bitcoin as a business that serves customers, growing our user base by an order of magnitude would be a great and celebration worthy achievement! Not at all a small constant factor :) And keeping the current user base happy and buying things is extremely interesting, both to me and Gavin. Without users Bitcoin is nothing at all. Not a settlement network, not anything. It's actually going to be quite hard to grow that much. As the white paper says, "the system works well enough for most transactions". And despite a lot of effort by many people, killer apps that use Bitcoin's unique features are still hit and miss. Perhaps Streamium, Lighthouse, ChangeTip, some distributed exchange or something else will stimulate huge new demand for transactions in future ..... but if so we're not there yet. --001a1140ebae585238051ca6c61d Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Whilst 1mb to 8mb might seem ir= relevant from a pure computer science perspective payment demand is not rea= lly infinite, at least not if by "payment" we mean something rese= mbling how current Bitcoin users use the network.

If we define "payment"= ; to mean the kind of thing that Bitcoin users and enthusiasts have been do= ing up until now, then suddenly 1mb to 8mb makes a ton of sense and doesn&#= 39;t really seem that small: we'd have to increase usage by nearly an o= rder of magnitude before it becomes an issue again!

If we think of Bitcoin as a b= usiness that serves customers, growing our user base by an order of magnitu= de would be a great and celebration worthy achievement! Not at all a small = constant factor :)=C2=A0

And keeping the current user = base happy and buying things is extremely interesting, both to me and Gavin= . Without users Bitcoin is nothing at all. Not a settlement network, not an= ything.

It's actually going to be quite hard to grow that much. As the = white paper says, "the system works well enough for most transactions&= quot;. And despite a lot of effort by many people, killer apps that use Bit= coin's unique features are still hit and miss. Perhaps Streamium, Light= house, ChangeTip, some distributed exchange or something else will stimulat= e huge new demand for transactions in future ..... but if so we're not = there yet.
--001a1140ebae585238051ca6c61d--