From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4CF8616E7 for ; Sun, 20 Sep 2015 09:25:05 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-ig0-f181.google.com (mail-ig0-f181.google.com [209.85.213.181]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 421CC31 for ; Sun, 20 Sep 2015 09:25:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: by igxx6 with SMTP id x6so41731828igx.1 for ; Sun, 20 Sep 2015 02:25:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=vinumeris.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=SaWX7EAaHGpGURAHUPlIJ/zJ6T4G7zO6WbEsb8ofX9I=; b=NwbOjWyXGwV9cDQfHZnVzd1wUGk0Cy8lKFpdJHT/BfBIREjSOgYQKpFO8cUTwghewF zlJwWur5Wxa4xh7TqBpHnwhVkFflCIdKdZVKcghDJF0otT5HWPlh8bLYWuPrBwywKLf4 xePgQpD5qHMBpK0LxQ4L5vNmLYQaxvoU9oPHw= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=SaWX7EAaHGpGURAHUPlIJ/zJ6T4G7zO6WbEsb8ofX9I=; b=TEP9ZM/v6E/8BmslTiqb7tEoICYhhJsayJFnNkM2pwXFvXlSbiDhj6tA8gGSOc1eyT Vap/1C0L7F/kc5BTwvrd0zkkNsW8R5IRGecJ3PN15rp1IiwdhHcgPX/JhkJnW0SzlCQq nk9/IG/3xCTcZQe6spL4nuvgmA0vFJJ1LEiDvyrkkOVZyFlrn/OtwX5DpNf8AD+L38+4 /Hq+5f79k5+9DBNmgtgqnMr8S+PxbBjGr9xhYB8NxqCcs3zXb1BPa7KyvTPyutzBN6R/ mo5UBS24JPukE6UxJruI0jXaIRD2TyzpcLvz7u+zSHuOG4JuycuReGHU82H1d/D5ifyH YhbA== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQl2ETorippKtdQHxoF+U/8VEEKc4SIXcw10MvBAxum15VBd9S0RWyKj5wnnmrpEDcPROxvd MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.50.17.4 with SMTP id k4mr6039153igd.34.1442741103521; Sun, 20 Sep 2015 02:25:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.50.192.233 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Sep 2015 02:25:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <55FDD951.9010709@gmail.com> References: <55F9E47D.50507@mattcorallo.com> <55FC6EBF.9090504@mattcorallo.com> <20150919014710.GD22598@muck> <20150919060639.A775A404B9@smtp.hushmail.com> <55FD0737.1080008@voskuil.org> <20150919072714.D3349404B9@smtp.hushmail.com> <55FD1122.5030107@voskuil.org> <20150919075758.820CC404B9@smtp.hushmail.com> <55FD225B.1050402@voskuil.org> <55FDD951.9010709@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2015 10:25:03 +0100 Message-ID: From: Mike Hearn To: moonpunter@gmail.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e011767bffad65605202a5665 X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,HTML_MESSAGE,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org Cc: bitcoin-dev Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Scaling Bitcoin conference micro-report X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2015 09:25:05 -0000 --089e011767bffad65605202a5665 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > Also, in the US, despite overwhelming resistance on a broad scale, > legislation continues to be presented which would violate the 2nd amendment > right to keep and bear arms. And yet the proposed legislation goes nowhere, and the USA continues to stand alone in having the first world's weakest gun control laws. You are just supporting my point with this example. Obama would like to restrict guns, but can't, because they are too popular (in the USA). The comparison to BitTorrent is likewise weak: governments hardly care about piracy. They care enough to pass laws occasionally, but not enough to put serious effort into enforcement. Wake me up when the USA establishes a Copyright Enforcement Administration with the same budget and powers as the DEA. Internet based black markets exist only because governments tolerate them (for now). A ban on Tor, Bitcoin or both would send them back to the pre-2011 state where they were virtually non-existent. Governments tolerate this sort of abuse only because they believe, I think correctly, that Bitcoin can have great benefits for their ordinary voters and for now are willing to let the tech industry experiment. But for that state of affairs to continue, the benefits must actually appear. That requires growth. I think there's a difference between natural growth and the kind of growth > that's being proposed by bank-backed start-ups and pro-censorship entities. > What difference? Are you saying the people who come to Bitcoin because of a startup are somehow less "natural" than other users? --089e011767bffad65605202a5665 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Also, in=C2=A0the US, despite overwhelming resistance on a bro= ad scale, legislation=C2=A0continues to be presented which would violate th= e 2nd amendment right to=C2=A0keep and bear arms.

And yet the proposed legislation goes nowhere, and the USA continues= to stand alone in having the first world's weakest gun control laws.

You are just supporting my point with this example.= Obama would like to restrict guns, but can't, because they are too pop= ular (in the USA).

The comparison to BitTorrent is= likewise weak: governments hardly care about piracy. They care enough to p= ass laws occasionally, but not enough to put serious effort into enforcemen= t. Wake me up when the USA establishes a Copyright Enforcement Administrati= on with the same budget and powers as the DEA.

Int= ernet based black markets exist only because governments tolerate them (for= now). A ban on Tor, Bitcoin or both would send them back to the pre-2011 s= tate where they were virtually non-existent. Governments tolerate this sort= of abuse only because they believe, I think correctly, that Bitcoin can ha= ve great benefits for their ordinary voters and for now are willing to let = the tech industry experiment.

But for that state o= f affairs to continue, the benefits must actually appear. That requires gro= wth.

I think there's a difference = between natural growth and the kind of=C2=A0growth that's being propose= d by bank-backed start-ups and pro-censorship=C2=A0entities.

What difference? Are you saying the people who come t= o Bitcoin because of a startup are somehow less "natural" than ot= her users?
--089e011767bffad65605202a5665--