From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 12FA45AE for ; Wed, 11 May 2016 22:58:51 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-lf0-f41.google.com (mail-lf0-f41.google.com [209.85.215.41]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48D7313D for ; Wed, 11 May 2016 22:58:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-lf0-f41.google.com with SMTP id j8so62161294lfd.2 for ; Wed, 11 May 2016 15:58:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject :from:to:cc; bh=qQt5dF38+wLLAOzjQNYwKPtijIJl5ZFyknISfpmFOTU=; b=a2IK1idNbmeS0ZHE39mXxax/1wVe9VrBnjQGdDhcMlbs3Mxakr3QZ7E994nEi5D0tl dVwTxE8hAphK/ozIiwHiyJ3Nzi8aSGka2nHfiMJ3bKXttctWeGnCbmYobYrINUhBYddA rleIc1qyScbxvrVpeJfSsaTxr3cVdK+xPGByZFuvmb04ApGMrljkrcL1xtRW3ekpiUO5 xHMk1AM1JOCrCl+wlP+RUbWd3sdETCJF9j8QjfHGWWWN8UqbRZTUULxWvVpKKJGXkypp 3VCW7p5IdBG/DD1sjsb/zmgvsVOilYhe6uSZghWIoXVyfLg1fMxxmn5+SAkxEoz75mgm 6RMA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc; bh=qQt5dF38+wLLAOzjQNYwKPtijIJl5ZFyknISfpmFOTU=; b=L39VayobGqptu+3sTd6V8LNDMLMngLeL37u+C24It7cDwIqaRe41kXJ+0TSK+W1fW8 zdwU2SzvZCR95YOtoWekNBnKhXmNI9X7RIarmM59mlToeUt7Io27vRlIUdF2ZNpUzven qsNYNxFmkets9DwQRJubJa4IxZ9xDhG/lD1GcoDG+4QMQBp8ne0pbmHFT0Rc5mh7QlQG uKj3ZIp4m0jLUwTspwycO3SxK1IT87h0FygbtuqtXdU6K3RIKI3PgIcx/q2toR/+OJ1T bApKUQzO1PEm/RlMhBAEepd3rkp1sgvoDFAtgMrHbL4F2OipA0yWtjyEsiVtpDeCvR3K DwgA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOPr4FUBLDmhLakcO+F++X1TRebko+4mUqXyL07V2SaUJt0lbGhn5oOUrJkwh5Dp/+L4FDe8QTxHqRlVGuQW0A== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.25.26.81 with SMTP id a78mr2852377lfa.6.1463007528786; Wed, 11 May 2016 15:58:48 -0700 (PDT) Sender: gmaxwell@gmail.com Received: by 10.112.65.108 with HTTP; Wed, 11 May 2016 15:58:48 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20160510185728.GA1149@fedora-21-dvm> <20160511103601.GC2439@banane.informatik.uni-ulm.de> Date: Wed, 11 May 2016 22:58:48 +0000 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 8H2uKG-ncjvlhM-1ijg0uWd0dCg Message-ID: From: Gregory Maxwell To: Timo Hanke , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID, FREEMAIL_FROM, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Making AsicBoost irrelevant X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 May 2016 22:58:51 -0000 On Wed, May 11, 2016 at 10:42 PM, Timo Hanke via bitcoin-dev wrote: > This is what I meant. If existing hardware gets forked-out it will > inevitably lead to the creation of an altcoin. Simply because the hardware > exists and can't be used for anything else both chains will survive. I was > only comparing the situation to a contentious hardfork that does not fork > out any hardware. If the latter one is suspected to lead to the permanent > existence of two chains then a hardfork that forks out hardware is even more > likely to do so (I claim it's guaranteed). There are already many altcoins out there, we could not prevent that even if we wanted to. New ones are created all the time. A 20% inherent advantage, in perfect competition, is likely to lead to an eventual monopoly of mining if monopoly patent right prohibit competitions-- if mining profits go are under the level of that enhancement everyone without it would be operating at a loss. Preserving a vulnerability that will ultimately harm the system's decentralization for just the betterment of some miners does not seem like a rational decision for the users of Bitcoin-- no more than it would reasonable to add a rule that all blocks must be signed by a particular private key. As an altcoin the "asicboost" altcoin would be one of the least interesting altcoins ever created... after all, no other altcoin has ever been created that required licensing in order to mine. I don't know if forking it out is the best move here and now, but I'm happy some people are thinking carefully about what it would take to do that.