public inbox for bitcoindev@googlegroups.com
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Natanael <natanael.l@gmail.com>
To: Tom Harding <tomh@thinlink.com>
Cc: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] BIP: Full Replace-by-Fee deployment schedule
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2015 03:10:23 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAAt2M18Bbcp8-saF7FbkY1vp9rUihStaTXawB9JjafX=+ZasFw@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <5591EA1B.1050709@thinlink.com>

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1387 bytes --]

Den 30 jun 2015 03:00 skrev "Tom Harding" <tomh@thinlink.com>:
>
> On 6/29/2015 5:51 PM, Natanael wrote:
>>
>> What you ask to see implemented will trivially fall to a sybil attack.
It isn't securable. It is running on the honor system exclusively. It will
be attacked, it will fail, losses will be had, the attackers will walk away
with embarrassingly large sums.
>
>
> Oh please.  Checking that a node does relay something is not much
different than banning it for relaying garbage.
>
> It just happens to require that you have two nodes and coordinate them
somehow.  I didn't offer a complete design, don't claim magical properties,
and certainly didn't mean to imply that nodes passing a test could be
trusted (as you suggest with your "accountable parties").

But the check means nothing at all to you since no information which you
can learn from doing so can be trusted for use in decision making of any
kind, so why do it? Unless you pay for hosting of that particular node
which you test, you have no reason to care for any reason other than simple
statistics.

The claims I made is based on simple economic analysis - if *to be able to
attack* first requires effort and risk that exceed the payoff, you're
unlikely to try. Being legally accountable and identified in advance and
having to build reputation before being trusted with attack-worthy sums is
strongly discouraging.

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1613 bytes --]

  reply	other threads:[~2015-06-30  1:10 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 20+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-06-29  5:07 [bitcoin-dev] BIP: Full Replace-by-Fee deployment schedule Peter Todd
2015-06-29  5:40 ` Luke Dashjr
2015-06-29  5:43   ` Gregory Maxwell
2015-06-29  5:51     ` Luke Dashjr
2015-06-29  5:56       ` Peter Todd
2015-06-29  5:53     ` Peter Todd
2015-06-29  6:00       ` Luke Dashjr
2015-06-29  6:16 ` sickpig
2015-06-30  0:21 ` Tom Harding
2015-06-30  0:51   ` Natanael
2015-06-30  1:00     ` Tom Harding
2015-06-30  1:10       ` Natanael [this message]
2015-06-30  1:18         ` Tom Harding
2015-06-30  1:37   ` Peter Todd
2015-06-30 13:12     ` Adam Back
2015-06-30 13:49       ` Chris Pacia
2015-06-30 14:53         ` Peter Todd
2015-06-30 14:02       ` David A. Harding
2015-06-30 16:05       ` Peter Todd
2015-06-30 18:23         ` Chris Pacia

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to='CAAt2M18Bbcp8-saF7FbkY1vp9rUihStaTXawB9JjafX=+ZasFw@mail.gmail.com' \
    --to=natanael.l@gmail.com \
    --cc=bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org \
    --cc=tomh@thinlink.com \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox