From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B6C079CDB for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2019 01:37:31 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-qt1-f174.google.com (mail-qt1-f174.google.com [209.85.160.174]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3429C13A for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2019 01:37:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-qt1-f174.google.com with SMTP id l11so2276678qtp.0 for ; Mon, 04 Feb 2019 17:37:30 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=J9/CLxR9eHdXwCva1bw6ZCIij859ppKfu0LH82JZPZo=; b=gyJsXESORWwAILRhMMkSSY9iwEFmaqtaMWZBv3My7MVkmesa9mFbQktFgwsH1dFeJv yFeK6daN8mqUHfD1UEihLtKSM59FEmgvqUZ7Mn1kzmRYmytq6k57o7nf3z58JD8tg6yo my3AlLP69+JvhEZZ9k+ssZbzRH+0cHgSwtk3txtrLDNaDKBRrGthPnX83Y5EZcBlbCKz DSW9J1I4dM7/zSHaVwuFOUAwcUi+6JgJ1/U7zpRDvBY0QW7wrc+5tDspmoA+CbqhUSOz Sh33MaJMwWnn0CQZol4ps7X/0ZmA758E2f1GqP6AH4oCc2N9di52snWvA4wNSGt20zg2 cNKQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAub2UqL2IoReVscFaB9sjTMWtlUvdiWgFYeApIS/mmXem/e0FEef hF1X5K40L/Hu6xVrL9N+/nPsEIJNBOHpboHMWpqI1Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYcVMEyjXi2obp/tWlmkdCUsvlD5k8zw3T2kF0EvyB2w7GFZNuu3FNWApHk+LJiY2b/VGtMxNat+xe1HZ6QmNU= X-Received: by 2002:a0c:ae76:: with SMTP id z51mr1811791qvc.103.1549330650041; Mon, 04 Feb 2019 17:37:30 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <2s__WN8iJ71DEJxYfCGbJpcp3lVLuOV95To49v3xc9XxyHod7ikfJU3EjYt2bSReGlKpjLxny0fR8KkEGjZynH8OFBoy_aCfWaScv9Vw5I4=@protonmail.com> In-Reply-To: From: Devrandom Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2019 17:37:16 -0800 Message-ID: To: James MacWhyte , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000009269205811ba7f1" X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,HTML_MESSAGE, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 05 Feb 2019 06:06:38 +0000 Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Card Shuffle To Bitcoin Seed X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2019 01:37:31 -0000 --00000000000009269205811ba7f1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I would suggest 50+ 6-sided dice rolls, giving about 128 bits of entropy. Compared to a shuffle, it's easier to be sure that you got the right amount of entropy, even if the dice are somewhat biased. On Mon, Feb 4, 2019 at 2:33 PM James MacWhyte via bitcoin-dev < bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > > James > > > On Sun, Feb 3, 2019 at 10:27 AM Ryan Havar via bitcoin-dev < > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > >> Conveniently a shuffled deck of cards also can serve as a physical backup >> which is easy to hide in plain sight with great plausible deniability. >> > > To make sure someone doesn't play with your cards and mix up the order, > use a permanent marker to draw a diagonal line on the side of the deck from > corner to corner. If the cards ever get mixed up, you can put them back in > order by making sure the diagonal line matches up. > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > --00000000000009269205811ba7f1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I would suggest 50+ 6-sided dice rolls, giving about 128 b= its of entropy.=C2=A0 Compared to a shuffle, it's easier to be sure tha= t you got the right amount of entropy, even if the dice are somewhat biased= .


On Mon, Feb 4, 2019 at 2:33 PM James MacWhyte via bitcoin-d= ev <bitcoin-dev= @lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:

James


On Sun, Feb 3= , 2019 at 10:27 AM Ryan Havar via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfo= undation.org> wrote:
Conveniently a shuffled deck of cards also can serve as a = physical backup which is easy to hide in plain sight with great plausible d= eniability.

To make sure someone does= n't play with your cards and mix up the order, use a permanent marker t= o draw a diagonal line on the side of the deck from corner to corner. If th= e cards ever get mixed up, you can put them back in order by making sure th= e diagonal line matches up.=C2=A0
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