From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.192] helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-1.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1WXFC5-0002hE-64 for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 19:26:57 +0000 Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of pixodegames.com designates 209.85.215.50 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.215.50; envelope-from=flavien.charlon@pixodegames.com; helo=mail-la0-f50.google.com; Received: from mail-la0-f50.google.com ([209.85.215.50]) by sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) id 1WXFC4-0000cu-0T for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 19:26:57 +0000 Received: by mail-la0-f50.google.com with SMTP id pv20so5126298lab.23 for ; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 12:26:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=739K33u7REUVJa6b1oCCyv0fsq9lSG+Bs0WREI9MM8Y=; b=Fq2qj6zcw4/Kp5yJfhR5TGsN2Fvtwk96irhCnNbNyzyzRSSnC8nniUcI9YvbisvRJY gWothH0JoCRgWn+7GnkxmzmaR+ou7E0C9GlfSCoDr4Sl46iHJ8U5is6Xeb/4WJEU/h4C xdeHmmUwstLEQ/tl+tUtZ8uK5wf1mOgRv9xaeeFo1/G3cypGVPp/SkkFXPr4taEeqAXt XeLxwwpUEuKWr8Hw2I00EkVMyxCDQZyc+oCAn56WXhIHh3+789GdhqAlkUotux7PcJws pY93fHUOewe9773W5cTEr0PHQZpiFactiT+OIOl7XibNpOUkYxP+sinDvKBcuQmewlWF Kbog== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnQUhEX1AF1OLGUMbhSW41/n3m+Tv6EFjpl3MB0yuRBEZkvQI4uAFo+eEQsbEcFXCmZGWrR X-Received: by 10.152.170.137 with SMTP id am9mr22488739lac.15.1396898809180; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 12:26:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-la0-f43.google.com (mail-la0-f43.google.com [209.85.215.43]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id bm3sm12546373lbb.12.2014.04.07.12.26.47 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 07 Apr 2014 12:26:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-la0-f43.google.com with SMTP id e16so5350481lan.30 for ; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 12:26:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.112.135.106 with SMTP id pr10mr21264929lbb.24.1396898807865; Mon, 07 Apr 2014 12:26:47 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.114.185.230 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Apr 2014 12:26:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Originating-IP: [79.97.126.227] In-Reply-To: References: <5341E1FF.7080204@monetize.io> <5342BEE0.3050204@monetize.io> From: Flavien Charlon Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2014 20:26:07 +0100 Message-ID: To: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Tim=F3n?= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e012292f83af89e04f678d9dd X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net. See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details. -1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for sender-domain 1.2 RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET RBL: Received via a relay in bl.spamcop.net [Blocked - see ] -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 1.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message -0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain 0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid -0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature 1.5 SF_NO_SPF_SPAM SF_NO_SPF_SPAM X-Headers-End: 1WXFC4-0000cu-0T Cc: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Feedback request: colored coins protocol X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 19:26:57 -0000 --089e012292f83af89e04f678d9dd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable An IOU written in a gold plate sure makes no sense. I see what you are saying, the inconvenience comes from the fact that the buyer has to buy some amount of BTC at the same time as he buys a share. That's why I was making the point that you could have a colored coin representing a single share, a different colored coin representing 10 shares, and another one representing 100 shares (like the different denominations of dollar bills). Assuming you have a proper application layer/UI that can hide this from the user, the need for padding is greatly reduced. My opinion is that the protocol should do the minimum required and remain as simple as possible. If a proper UI can work around this, then it might not be worth complicating the protocol for this. Also, the dust rule may disappear all together one day (it's already been slashed heavily to 540 satoshis), at which point we'll be left with a useless padding parameter. It's easier to add something when you need it than to remove it. But I am posting here to see how people feel about this, and I see you are on the opinion that satoshi_value and color_value should have a degree of freedom between each other. Thanks for the feedback. On Mon, Apr 7, 2014 at 7:23 PM, Jorge Tim=F3n wrote: > On 4/7/14, Flavien Charlon wrote: > > Ok, I guess I'm not using the proper terminology. It would be listed on > the > > "Asset" section of the company's balance sheet, is what I meant. > > No, it's an asset for the owner of the share, not the company, just > like the gold plates are not assets for the company when someone else > holds them. > What you're doing is getting less capital for the company due to the > money that is going to pay the gold costs. > Are you rising capital or selling gold? > It doesn't make sense to do both at once. > You need money, why would you spend money on gold before asking for > other people's money to build your company? > Investors will appreciate the convenience of being able to buy shares > of your company and gold separately (or not buy gold at all). > > It may even be more clear for other use cases different than stocks. > Does an IOU written in a gold plate make sense to you? > --089e012292f83af89e04f678d9dd Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
An IOU written in a gold plate sure makes no sense. I= see what you are saying, the inconvenience comes from the fact that the bu= yer has to buy some amount of BTC at the same time as he buys a share.

That's why I was making the point that you could ha= ve a colored coin representing a single share, a different colored coin rep= resenting 10 shares, and another one representing 100 shares (like the diff= erent denominations of dollar bills). Assuming you have a proper applicatio= n layer/UI that can hide this from the user, the need for padding is greatl= y reduced. My opinion is that the protocol should do the minimum required a= nd remain as simple as possible. If a proper UI can work around this, then = it might not be worth complicating the protocol for this. Also, the dust ru= le may disappear all together one day (it's already been slashed heavil= y to 540 satoshis), at which point we'll be left with a useless padding= parameter. It's easier to add something when you need it than to remov= e it.

But I am posting here to see how people feel about this= , and I see you are on the opinion that satoshi_value and color_value shoul= d have a degree of freedom between each other. Thanks for the feedback.


On Mon,= Apr 7, 2014 at 7:23 PM, Jorge Tim=F3n <jtimon@monetize.io>= wrote:
On 4/7/14, Flavien Charlon <flavien.charlon@coinprism.com= > wrote:
> Ok, I guess I'm not using the proper terminology. It would be list= ed on the
> "Asset" section of the company's balance sheet, is what = I meant.

No, it's an asset for the owner of the share, not the company, ju= st
like the gold plates are not assets for the company when someone else
holds them.
What you're doing is getting less capital for the company due to the money that is going to pay the gold costs.
Are you rising capital or selling gold?
It doesn't make sense to do both at once.
You need money, why would you spend money on gold before asking for
other people's money to build your company?
Investors will appreciate the convenience of being able to buy shares
of your company and gold separately (or not buy gold at all).

It may even be more clear for other use cases different than stocks.
Does an IOU written in a gold plate make sense to you?

--089e012292f83af89e04f678d9dd--