From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org (smtp4.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::137]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E91AC000D for ; Tue, 14 Sep 2021 14:07:59 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E82C440322 for ; Tue, 14 Sep 2021 14:07:58 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: smtp4.osuosl.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp4.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 35suDUrdtvk1 for ; Tue, 14 Sep 2021 14:07:58 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 Received: from mail-yb1-xb36.google.com (mail-yb1-xb36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b36]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DE05A4031F for ; Tue, 14 Sep 2021 14:07:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-yb1-xb36.google.com with SMTP id z5so28510332ybj.2 for ; Tue, 14 Sep 2021 07:07:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=BJJYIrMdbjzyqiMry6KvbT5yj80CAJ12wvLJjZzZ/go=; b=J5B/Vi/QFwzIN4YOpp8tmdvjGo16DLlFNK0xll6kbBt75X8JNdCad9bnZQbwUGpDD5 GdY2+yVCZ2zoWreCfBhtEdCFpgdhNjkwf6H/cv++hkBa4JzFgCDFy0w4LyM3fKoubC4i ie8Sup6BMrQYWRRV3N+1/Wb9cDo8TpguRFb0a06buFp2C6qJqN2abcJMm9G1216i0Rna vR1IP92Xu70/2Nbb0Cud1K3KpGK+H+f+9QHsCXtR9pfuW+qrs3+7LQgFl1RPX8TxeWI9 kJhGz7trzMoQMYIRWwQU8DAw4lVMlWWtjwM4sFP7gLkwOeBSbA3M00EcvwIPcAbopH9u RUjA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=BJJYIrMdbjzyqiMry6KvbT5yj80CAJ12wvLJjZzZ/go=; b=8CgbQIE4aVHgiA+tkasbcIFvq7Da2vVWHc79vDYIkkpibtu9qPy1FcfX5+XiMi5A7r XnnuyQrHLXhUoT4PWb3l9v4wqlKvxHVIYJMTALunwenfyEYAeR2bG/DkyvxCEItia/Oe NVGWxhjixbPIQVvd5pIicyMtEMU0QzFMNXDnG8XpMnT2pgjGUFj/c+ocYSwAMzQ1Hm42 Hx6r165IxVU7TmkbP2qbgwtnrU72cIwu+Ul1JsMKbPp/wMG6gKVtLVXvzVWCHwez/1oT tgTer1cAcuVIT2XlnwS7cICZG8MbTKYq4sr2EYZQ7cU4t6E+GPi4IGWQhXpbJQDXmLny DL9A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531M0dXRA0NGSVtGD9uBcYliojPxquW6GpTkOj9nN/Lf9j+H/riF uqYiIGwEIATtzMzB9IV0VcZYGh+SCmyHKJR6hdsytNt8KcQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJz+Nx090V6Q1jqeHEVxJXIeJFtZGq1mu9Uzqstb4xSTO2NLD8ccCh0S58j66Vnw8AxXS638XGRKC62C/XOzUMY= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6902:72d:: with SMTP id l13mr23953330ybt.168.1631628476802; Tue, 14 Sep 2021 07:07:56 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Michael Folkson Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2021 15:07:46 +0100 Message-ID: To: Prayank Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 14 Sep 2021 14:12:54 +0000 Cc: Bitcoin Dev Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] BIP process meeting - Tuesday September 14th 23:00 UTC on #bitcoin-dev Libera IRC X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2021 14:07:59 -0000 Hey Prayank Thanks for the suggestions. > bitcoin-dev mailing list link can be considered a BIP and saved in a BIP = directory. Anyone can create such directories. So BIP is nothing but a prop= osal shared on bitcoin-dev mailing list. A mailing list post is static and a BIP will go normally go through multiple edits and revisions so you do need to take advantage of the Git version control system. It gets quite unwieldy to attempt to do that via a mailing list with every minor suggested edit getting sent to all subscribers. Also allowing the entire global population (billions of people) to be able to create a directory doesn't sound like a good idea to me :) > This will avoid the 'bitcoin/bips' repository being considered as some BI= P authority that approves BIPs and proposals can improve Bitcoin without us= ing the repository. Repository will only be helpful in documenting BIP corr= ectly. I can only speak for myself here but I am not particularly concerned about this perception of authority. We need a central repo that we can all refer to (rather than BIPs being distributed across a large number of repos) and that central repo needs to managed and maintained by somebody (in this case the two BIP editors Kalle and Luke). In the same way as there are limits on the ability of Core maintainers to unilaterally merge in contentious code changes there are similar limits on the ability of BIP editors. Ultimately anyone merging a PR has to consider process/consensus and concerns can (and have been in the past) be raised on this mailing list or elsewhere. > 2. Bot in `bitcoin/bips` repository that notifies about pull requests bas= ed on different things. This will help maintainer(s) and contributors. I'm not sure where you are suggesting a bot should be. On IRC? There is a BIP merges bot on Mastodon[0] that I'm aware of and obviously you can subscribe to GitHub repo notification emails. > 3. BIP Gallery: I tried sharing things in a different way so that newbies= can understand importance of BIPs in Bitcoin and relate to it: https://pra= yank23.github.io/BIPsGallery/ however couldn't complete it with all the BIP= s because not many people considered it helpful. There were few suggestions= to improve it by adding some text for each BIP and better image gallery. M= aybe someone else can create a better project. This looks cool. I think we can definitely do better in encouraging more people to engage with the BIP process especially as the ideas start flowing in post Taproot activation brainstorming what should be in the "next soft fork" (trademark!). Some of the BIPs (e.g. the Taproot BIPs 340-342) are quite technically dense so someone on IRC suggested making greater use of informational BIPs to supplement the standard BIPs for new implementers or even casual readers. [0] https://x0f.org/@bipmerges On Tue, Sep 14, 2021 at 1:17 PM Prayank wrote: > > Hi Michael, > > Thanks for sharing the details about the meeting. > > Wishlist has some interesting points. I would like to suggest few things: > > 1.BIP process: > > A. Plan and document a proposal > > B. Open PR in https://github.com/bitcoin/bips and edit everything properl= y > > C. BIP is assigned a number and merged > > D. Share the proposal on bitcoin dev mailing list > > bitcoin-dev mailing list link can be considered a BIP and saved in a BIP = directory. Anyone can create such directories. So BIP is nothing but a prop= osal shared on bitcoin-dev mailing list. > > Who implements the BIP? When is it implemented? How is it implemented? Op= inions on proposal etc. will be different for each BIP. This will avoid the= 'bitcoin/bips' repository being considered as some BIP authority that appr= oves BIPs and proposals can improve Bitcoin without using the repository. R= epository will only be helpful in documenting BIP correctly. > > 2. Bot in `bitcoin/bips` repository that notifies about pull requests bas= ed on different things. This will help maintainer(s) and contributors. > > 3. BIP Gallery: I tried sharing things in a different way so that newbies= can understand importance of BIPs in Bitcoin and relate to it: https://pra= yank23.github.io/BIPsGallery/ however couldn't complete it with all the BIP= s because not many people considered it helpful. There were few suggestions= to improve it by adding some text for each BIP and better image gallery. M= aybe someone else can create a better project. > > > -- > Prayank > > A3B1 E430 2298 178F --=20 Michael Folkson Email: michaelfolkson@gmail.com Keybase: michaelfolkson PGP: 43ED C999 9F85 1D40 EAF4 9835 92D6 0159 214C FEE3