From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from sog-mx-1.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.191] helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-2.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1VQ7DT-0008TN-7E for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Sun, 29 Sep 2013 02:58:39 +0000 X-ACL-Warn: Received: from mail-ob0-f175.google.com ([209.85.214.175]) by sog-mx-1.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) id 1VQ7DR-00029t-RW for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Sun, 29 Sep 2013 02:58:39 +0000 Received: by mail-ob0-f175.google.com with SMTP id uz6so4274792obc.34 for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2013 19:58:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=AhSPagVh2kXOwwjbOGwtDmgreGDzKlf1S6tI6iwgO3Y=; b=Wc1OhrVP6BS2nPiyp5FxoZJ9ArsWU6BHHQN7XhPt7SYIB9pmzK1tsY2XL3zmWv/wnr 7x2GKZ+58f4g9tDeBjOwpqEO9jIaVd5TeXIM+49Hg1sqLZdz8Li54HMiva0zH+/zcUYS smlIHxHGr0K+U6VlV6reMdngta8XMcYNd3NP65lsGmkHxR4RYrFQ4HhmowROiaCQeJQ5 YlLeQQVggR/3QOe0wHbO2s1i89NnujtIqMePqlJ1OVhgjlBYWcHzwpkWwf1/HIrhxbBg +h2NMefQmtCI4Y++EIQ1UZo53+5gCBD7LY2QdVVheBgFjxTwjyGXoIkOEe/yCTN2Lqk9 FzEg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQlCQRWCtUjXfiBVeKD/RVYnZISFdtLxWRxjKiHliAABTArC45Z+4laoBmSRyzyt7mBSmEri X-Received: by 10.182.237.44 with SMTP id uz12mr13287725obc.11.1380421746463; Sat, 28 Sep 2013 19:29:06 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.76.74.168 with HTTP; Sat, 28 Sep 2013 19:28:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Originating-IP: [118.92.76.15] In-Reply-To: <2c70dbfc173749cf4198c591f19a7d33@astutium.com> References: <2c70dbfc173749cf4198c591f19a7d33@astutium.com> From: Neil Fincham Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2013 15:28:26 +1300 Message-ID: To: rob.golding@astutium.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e89a8ff1cf52d6ad5104e77c7b8a X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net. See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details. 0.0 URIBL_BLOCKED ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE: The query to URIBL was blocked. See http://wiki.apache.org/spamassassin/DnsBlocklists#dnsbl-block for more information. [URIs: doubleclick.net] 1.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.0 LOTS_OF_MONEY Huge... sums of money X-Headers-End: 1VQ7DR-00029t-RW Cc: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] smart contracts -- possible use case? yes or no? X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2013 02:58:39 -0000 --e89a8ff1cf52d6ad5104e77c7b8a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I subscribe to this list so I can keep up-to date with bitcoin development, can we keep philosophy and tax evasion out of it? Neil On 29 September 2013 09:15, wrote: > > But the regulatory environment in many geographical regions in > > uncertain. Do we need to pay capital gains? Do we need to pay a > > sales taxs etc. etc. > > In most regions it's not only 'simple' but trivial - BTC is just > 'another currency' and accounted for exactly the same way - it doens't > matter if you sell your hose for GBP, USD, EUR, BTC or sacks of Pig > Dung, you still have a GBP tax issue ... > > > So my idea is to voluntarily pre empt legislation by giving donations > > to govt (aka taxation) for bitcoin service providers. > > You want to volunteer to pay tax ? I'd suggest stronger medication ... > > > However, there is something of a problem with voluntary donations. > > Most people are not satisfied with the way they are spent. > > 80% of 'donations' end up spent on 'adminsitration' and not what they > were donated for, this is a 'greed' issue not a 'currency' issue. > > > In the UK > > a recent survey said that only 18% of people thought that tax money > > was wisely spent. > > Tax isn't voluntary or a donation. The 18% who think UK tax is well > spent are the 18% of the population who get the tax money, not the 82% > that pay it ;) > > > Can we fix it? > > First we kill all the politicians ... > > > So let's say I run a business and I make 1 million euros. I wish to > > donate 10% of my profits to society. But let's say I dont want that > > money to go to wars of aggression, but rather, to the fire > > de[department. > > So give it to the FD - what you do with your post-tax profits are up to > you ;) > > > At this point everyone wins. The business person is happy to make a > > contribution. The govt. is happy that it gets more revenue. The > > fire dept. is happy that it has revenue to do its work. And > > everything has gone to the right place in a kind of democratic way. > > Where does gov't come into this ? I think you're confusing 'tax' which > you have zero control over and 'donations' which you already have 100% > control over. > > Rob > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > October Webinars: Code for Performance > Free Intel webinars can help you accelerate application performance. > Explore tips for MPI, OpenMP, advanced profiling, and more. Get the most > from > the latest Intel processors and coprocessors. See abstracts and register > > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=60133471&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk > _______________________________________________ > Bitcoin-development mailing list > Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development > --e89a8ff1cf52d6ad5104e77c7b8a Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I subscribe to this list so I can keep up-to date with bit= coin development, can we keep philosophy and tax evasion out of it?
Neil


On 29 September 2013 09:15, <rob.golding@astutium.com> wrote:
> But the regulatory environment in many geographical = regions in
> uncertain. =A0 Do we need to pay capital gains?=A0=A0 Do we need to pa= y a
> sales taxs etc. etc.

In most regions it's not only 'simple' but trivial - BTC = is just
'another currency' and accounted for exactly the same way - it doen= s't
matter if you sell your hose for GBP, USD, EUR, BTC or sacks of Pig
Dung, you still have a GBP tax issue ...

> So my idea is to voluntarily pre empt legislation by giving donations<= br> > to govt (aka taxation) for bitcoin service providers.=A0

You want to volunteer to pay tax ? I'd suggest stronger medicatio= n ...

> However, there is something of a problem with voluntary donations.=A0<= br> > Most people are not satisfied with the way they are spent.

80% of 'donations' end up spent on 'adminsitration' a= nd not what they
were donated for, this is a 'greed' issue not a 'currency' = issue.

> In the UK
> a recent survey said that only 18% of people thought that tax money > was wisely spent.

Tax isn't voluntary or a donation. The 18% who think UK tax is we= ll
spent are the 18% of the population who get the tax money, not the 82%
that pay it ;)

> Can we fix it?

First we kill all the politicians ...

> So let's say I run a business and I make 1 million euros.=A0 I wis= h to
> donate 10% of my profits to society.=A0 But let's say I dont want = that
> money to go to wars of aggression, but rather, to the fire
> de[department.=A0

So give it to the FD - what you do with your post-tax profits are up = to
you ;)

> At this point everyone wins.=A0 The business person is happy to make a=
> contribution.=A0 The govt. is happy that it gets more revenue.=A0 The<= br> > fire dept. is happy that it has revenue to do its work.=A0 And
> everything has gone to the right place in a kind of democratic way.
Where does gov't come into this ? I think you're confusing &#= 39;tax' which
you have zero control over and 'donations' which you already have 1= 00%
control over.

Rob

---------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---
October Webinars: Code for Performance
Free Intel webinars can help you accelerate application performance.
Explore tips for MPI, OpenMP, advanced profiling, and more. Get the most fr= om
the latest Intel processors and coprocessors. See abstracts and register &g= t;
http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gam= pad/clk?id=3D60133471&iu=3D/4140/ostg.clktrk
_______________________________________________
Bitcoin-development mailing list
Bitcoin-develo= pment@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-de= velopment

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