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[2607:f8b0:4864:20::1032]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 8926c6da1cb9f-4f2cbda8a05si54140173.2.2025.03.20.22.44.47 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 Mar 2025 22:44:47 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of melvincarvalho@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::1032 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::1032; Received: by mail-pj1-x1032.google.com with SMTP id 98e67ed59e1d1-2ff797f8f1bso2693649a91.3 for ; Thu, 20 Mar 2025 22:44:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCW6vgMlhIntMUuGziz7zRi0BXScS7KIM0g4cZLg9r7XZ+S4wbnpbpDTpdHUdo842iO9cBDYxP96fyb1@googlegroups.com X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncvyXH/ZulGUZdIu1Y0MsAP8djcH3xZO7U3qNKr5OEsX8v6hg26KQhJcVhif990 YCQGRaoY1jh9m1JT48sWJ139DIAH7b9IEOLkpDfgSPLVUMUczHR6LM2mlee0QyZi5uD2s8CyToN 0f9ojcq+IOWStD44uiiNl8tYGe X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:1c08:b0:2fe:68a5:d84b with SMTP id 98e67ed59e1d1-3030fe6a08amr2637256a91.1.1742535886973; Thu, 20 Mar 2025 22:44:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <9FAA7EEC-BD22-491E-B21B-732AEA15F556@sprovoost.nl> <7c28f8e9-d221-4633-8b71-53b4db07fa78@schildbach.de> In-Reply-To: <7c28f8e9-d221-4633-8b71-53b4db07fa78@schildbach.de> From: Melvin Carvalho Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2025 06:44:35 +0100 X-Gm-Features: AQ5f1JqRtrhmKma-wihAZMEmS0UUHaK2AxdJagoM1JC8_l_UIruyT9r1J8aZ1B8 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] Does anyone still need testnet3? To: Andreas Schildbach Cc: Sjors Provoost , Bitcoin Development Mailing List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000008d31840630d3c018" X-Original-Sender: melvincarvalho@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com header.s=20230601 header.b=i2SZ8PPM; spf=pass (google.com: domain of melvincarvalho@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::1032 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=melvincarvalho@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE sp=QUARANTINE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com; dara=pass header.i=@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; contact bitcoindev+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 786775582512 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) --0000000000008d31840630d3c018 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable p=C3=A1 14. 3. 2025 v 14:01 odes=C3=ADlatel 'Andreas Schildbach' via Bitcoi= n Development Mailing List napsal: > Hi Sjors, > > thanks for asking. > > Bitcoinj has just started to implement testnet4, but it's not finished > yet. And the next version 0.18 will probably not be released within 12 > months, maybe longer. > > By the way, testnet3 works great for us (for testing). I consider block > storms a feature, because it tests our code in rough conditions. We had > planned to support both testnets in the forseeable future. > > https://github.com/bitcoinj/bitcoinj/ > > Then, there is btc-rpc-explorer, a self-hostable block explorer. It > doesn't yet support testnet4. I'm not affiliated to it, I'm just a user. > > https://github.com/janoside/btc-rpc-explorer Main issue with testnet3 is getting coins for developers to use it, especially with high fees. A neat idea might be to make an app to swap between testnet3 and testnet4 coins. Or even an AMM. If there's a decent amount of interest in this, I could give it a go. > > > Cheers, > Andreas > > > On 14/03/2025 09.52, Sjors Provoost wrote: > > Dear list, > > > > Testnet 4 was proposed last year in BIP94 [0] and is supported by > Bitcoin Core since v28. > > > > To make Bitcoin Core easier to maintain we would like to drop support > for Testnet3 in a future release. This will happen no earlier than v30 th= is > fall. The upcoming v29 release still supports it, and will throughout its > maintenance period [1]. > > > > The network itself can't be deleted, so anyone willing to maintain node > software themselves can keep using testnet3 until the end of time. > > > > One of the motivations for introducing testnet4 was that testnet3 becam= e > increasing impractical to use due to block storms. So perhaps everyone > already moved on to using testnet4 or a signet. > > > > As an aside, it's possible to create a pure proof-of-work permissionles= s > signet without any signatures, by setting the challenge to OP_TRUE. [2] > > > > However, if anyone is still using testnet3 and needs more time to move > away from it, please let us know. E.g. as a reply to the list or a commen= t > on the Github issue [3]. This could include libraries, staging > environments, testnet wallets, etc. > > > > Although the v29 maintenance window will last for a few years, it's als= o > important to know if dropping testnet3 would prevent you from upgrading t= o > the next major node version. In other words, if migrating away from > testnet3 would take you longer than all of 2025. > > > > Although "I don't feel like it" isn't a great technical argument, it's > still useful to know what to expect and perhaps others can help. > > > > - Sjors > > > > [0] https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0094.mediawiki > > [1] https://bitcoincore.org/en/lifecycle/#maintenance-period > > [2] > https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0325.mediawiki#specificat= ion > > [3] https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/31975 > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/7c28f8e9-d221-4633-8b71-53b4= db07fa78%40schildbach.de > . > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/= CAKaEYhLuQDMKXaVhbQ2BrwHdHg7zPBiO-NgH6GhACufoqR2T4A%40mail.gmail.com. --0000000000008d31840630d3c018 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


p=C3=A1 14. 3. = 2025 v=C2=A014:01 odes=C3=ADlatel 'Andreas Schildbach' via Bitcoin = Development Mailing List <bitcoindev@googlegroups.com> napsal:
Hi Sjors,

thanks for asking.

Bitcoinj has just started to implement testnet4, but it's not finished =
yet. And the next version 0.18 will probably not be released within 12
months, maybe longer.

By the way, testnet3 works great for us (for testing). I consider block storms a feature, because it tests our code in rough conditions. We had planned to support both testnets in the forseeable future.

https://github.com/bitcoinj/bitcoinj/

Then, there is btc-rpc-explorer, a self-hostable block explorer. It
doesn't yet support testnet4. I'm not affiliated to it, I'm jus= t a user.

https://github.com/janoside/btc-rpc-explorer

Main issue with testnet3 is getting coins for deve= lopers to use it, especially with high fees.

A nea= t idea might be to make an app to swap between testnet3 and testnet4 coins.= =C2=A0 Or even an AMM.

If there's a decent amo= unt of interest in this, I could give it a go.
=C2=A0


Cheers,
Andreas


On 14/03/2025 09.52, Sjors Provoost wrote:
> Dear list,
>
> Testnet 4 was proposed last year in BIP94 [0] and is supported by Bitc= oin Core since v28.
>
> To make Bitcoin Core easier to maintain we would like to drop support = for Testnet3 in a future release. This will happen no earlier than v30 this= fall. The upcoming v29 release still supports it, and will throughout its = maintenance period [1].
>
> The network itself can't be deleted, so anyone willing to maintain= node software themselves can keep using testnet3 until the end of time. >
> One of the motivations for introducing testnet4 was that testnet3 beca= me increasing impractical to use due to block storms. So perhaps everyone a= lready moved on to using testnet4 or a signet.
>
> As an aside, it's possible to create a pure proof-of-work permissi= onless signet without any signatures, by setting the challenge to OP_TRUE. = [2]
>
> However, if anyone is still using testnet3 and needs more time to move= away from it, please let us know. E.g. as a reply to the list or a comment= on the Github issue [3]. This could include libraries, staging environment= s, testnet wallets, etc.
>
> Although the v29 maintenance window will last for a few years, it'= s also important to know if dropping testnet3 would prevent you from upgrad= ing to the next major node version. In other words, if migrating away from = testnet3 would take you longer than all of 2025.
>
> Although "I don't feel like it" isn't a great techni= cal argument, it's still useful to know what to expect and perhaps othe= rs can help.
>
> - Sjors
>
> [0] https://github.com/bitcoin/bi= ps/blob/master/bip-0094.mediawiki
> [1] https://bitcoincore.org/en/lifecycl= e/#maintenance-period
> [2] https://github.= com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0325.mediawiki#specification
> [3] https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/31= 975
>

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