From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B05E3A5E for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2019 01:02:49 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: from auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mo.garage.hdemail.jp (mo.garage.hdemail.jp [46.51.242.127]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C2973821 for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2019 01:02:48 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ip-10-217-1-36.ap-northeast-1.compute.internal (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mo.garage.hdemail.jp (hde-mf-postfix) with SMTP id 5119B14C0C5 for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2019 10:02:47 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from karljohan-alm@garage.co.jp) X-Received: from unknown (HELO mo.garage.hdemail.jp) (127.0.0.1) by 0 with SMTP; 10 Mar 2019 10:02:47 +0900 X-Received: from mo.garage.hdemail.jp (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mo.garage.hdemail.jp (hde-ma-postfix) with ESMTP id 382384C06D for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2019 10:02:47 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from karljohan-alm@garage.co.jp) Received: from gw14.oz.hdemail.jp (ip-10-188-130-13.ap-northeast-1.compute.internal [10.188.130.13]) by mo.garage.hdemail.jp (hde-mf-postfix) with ESMTP id 280CB14C0C5 for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2019 10:02:47 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from karljohan-alm@garage.co.jp) X-Received: from mail-qk1-f200.google.com (lb05.oz.hdemail.jp [54.238.57.175]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gw14.oz.hdemail.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB76C148C11A for ; Sun, 10 Mar 2019 10:02:46 +0900 (JST) X-Received: by mail-qk1-f200.google.com with SMTP id b11so1362368qka.3 for ; Sat, 09 Mar 2019 17:02:46 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=KQc9qad+QI024KMVvQhN8IibFTi58TT3hD9N8M6o/4w=; b=CO5ueIa2NqDwU+vWZCe22AfqxzRkpARl0n4olrWxCYsscYnBEtG21hdVovbypuZU0W b/w9hRdg+BHSGZslE5NEKcIxG5YpLDAL1VaeSl647zfR7/imFAIetosLtRY1gwQStIht OS4QnCSKvPsKkyXcW993HygUUiI34QM8VIKcERgqfULHo9KEqdysosXplcYP5tVEvJAO ASSoCjNIkJj81LbBhn8m25N9Z5VPyMz4Nl70NQ3epjrbXHvq9jnR3p1QWWoxt0D5gQKu 7/0rvQnlbLFZYP7EVQl6wRLg22M6JEBjdnMu58D/w8iY9moQgizBHBNg+GMH6hk3Lmfe sivw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVaAhvdwWJ/EbZjs0Y3k2cJSMJuMAseF1FmGrKCFAlPRjxnGkIP cVPrsamD0eRFcPE5VU4Hp2B7CemkVj28NxTygoG9HoLdIDuA6yxdVhbBPtFWY4WqVdVQxBMUh/9 OExqtidRfq2evlxsaBWusmPE/QP5UTArfJXHBDHLn2kP62A6ejhFs//2E2UHUHqcEfzK7LZKtkI hq6vUqOr7D3FeTojHRzQPKoS1uQlwVZ87thFvehRSXu2sk75F06wGhRY/bPvGP5+oLMPCsVpqfk HvDha1Twsq0ERj1cYhYCH7kYJ7yoxPrV1+ansx1DmEuyFEb7XE0LmQBOS57v+auSh6RXo/2NX0J GFPOpLIZ0WeJs4CYqDtza0Vd0kE= X-Received: by 2002:ae9:ec13:: with SMTP id h19mr9309602qkg.345.1552179765374; Sat, 09 Mar 2019 17:02:45 -0800 (PST) X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqx1lWJZ6gJMfCc+DfbrgbewSjJWumcM7Bnij1hLI6O1s+vAo0XTZYSRPnOaqLRQMytQSb9JUA95844ULq8dZK0= X-Received: by 2002:ae9:ec13:: with SMTP id h19mr9309591qkg.345.1552179765114; Sat, 09 Mar 2019 17:02:45 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Karl-Johan Alm Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2019 10:02:34 +0900 Message-ID: To: lautaro.dragan@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 10 Mar 2019 13:22:48 +0000 Cc: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Signet X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2019 01:02:49 -0000 Hi Lautaro, Using regtest is not ideal for public networks, as anyone anywhere can just rewrite the blockchain at their whim by mining a ton of blocks. On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 4:52 AM Lautaro Dragan wr= ote: > > Hi Karl-Johan, my two cents: > > At Po.et we use regtest to simulate reorgs in integration tests in Travis= / CircleCI. It has proved quite useful. > > In general regtest for automated testing has given us all we needed so fa= r, but I admit we have a rather simple use of Bitcoin right now (colored co= ins). > > For local development, we sometimes use a script that "mines" blocks in r= egtest periodically. It was my goal to also use this method in QA, although= we wound up using testnet and didn't encounter any problems so far. > > Out of curiosity: what limitations did you find in using, for example, a = private network of bitcoin core nodes running regtest? (this gives you the = same power as centralization without any changes or extra functionality req= uired) > > El vie., 8 de mar. de 2019 a la(s) 16:02, Karl-Johan Alm via bitcoin-dev = escribi=C3=B3: >> >> Hello, >> >> As some of you already know, I've been working on a network called "sign= et", which is bascially a complement to the already existing testnet, excep= t it is completely centralized, and blocks are signed by a specific key rat= her than using proof of work. >> >> Benefits of this: >> >> 1. It is more predictable than testnet. Miners appear and disappear regu= larly, causing irregular block generation. >> >> 2. Since it is centrally controlled, it is easy to perform global testin= g, such as reorgs (e.g. the network performs a 4 block reorg by request, or= as scheduled). >> >> 3. It is more stable than testnet, which occasionally sees several thous= and block reorgs. >> >> 4. It is trivial to spin up (and shut down) new signets to make public t= ests where anyone can participate. >> >> Anyone can create a signet at any time, simply by creating a key pair an= d creating a challenge (scriptPubKey). The network can then be used globall= y by anyone, assuming the creator sends some coins to the other participant= s. >> >> Having a persistent signet would be beneficial in particular to services= which need a stable place to test features over an extended period of time= . My own company implements protocols on top of Bitcoin with sidechains. We= need multi-node test frameworks to behave in a predictable manner (unlike = testnet) and with the same standardness relay policy as mainnet. >> >> Signets consist of 2 parameters: the challenge script (scriptPubKey) and= the solution length. (The latter is needed to retain fixed length block he= aders, despite having an additional payload.) >> >> I propose that a default persistent "signet1" is created, which can be r= eplaced in future versions e.g. if the coins are unwisely used as real mone= y, similarly to what happened to previous testnets. This signet is picked b= y default if a user includes -signet without providing any of the parameter= s mentioned above. The key holder would be someone sufficiently trusted in = the community, who would be willing to run the system (block generation cod= e, faucet, etc). It could be made a little more sturdy by using 1-of-N mult= isig as the challenge, in case 1 <=3D x < N of the signers disappear. If pe= ople oppose this, it can be skipped, but will mean people can't just jump o= nto signet without first tracking down parameters from somewhere. >> >> Implementation-wise, the code adds an std::map with block hash to block = signature. This is serialized/deserialized as appropriate (Segwit witness s= tyle), which means block headers in p2p messages are (80 + solution_length)= bytes. Block header non-contextual check goes from checking if block heade= r hash < target to checking if the payload is a valid signature for the blo= ck header hash instead. >> >> Single commit with code (will split into commits and make PR later, but = just to give an idea what it looks like): https://github.com/kallewoof/bitc= oin/pull/4 >> >> I don't think this PR is overly intrusive, and I'm hoping to be able to = get signet code into Bitcoin Core eventually, and am equally hopeful that d= evs of other (wallet etc) implementations will consider supporting it. >> >> Feedback requested on this. >> >> Attribution: parts of the signet code (in particular signblock and getne= wblockhex) were adapted from the ElementsProject/elements repository. When = PR is split into atomic commits, I will put appropriate attribution there. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> bitcoin-dev mailing list >> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org >> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev