From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp3.osuosl.org (smtp3.osuosl.org [140.211.166.136]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD77FC000A for ; Fri, 16 Apr 2021 13:56:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp3.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF64160715 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 2021 13:56:27 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: smtp3.osuosl.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=blockstream-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from smtp3.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp3.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XaM_kD-L5935 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 2021 13:56:23 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 Received: from mail-qk1-x72a.google.com (mail-qk1-x72a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::72a]) by smtp3.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 71079605EE for ; Fri, 16 Apr 2021 13:56:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-qk1-x72a.google.com with SMTP id x11so28816204qkp.11 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 2021 06:56:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=blockstream-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=ivPfFQfDMkc9CV9gkJn6cNL3QJqu24JbKny1J4yCyxE=; b=xQwGRwv8JXMTPbi39U/XN1uQq0MniBo3PtQs9nooE52P0HRkZFuwv7mLgjnhPRlm3B QOUM2DYUExwsOwkRiUchmnPyq7YffcReDIsCVwBK7ZHva2OBHotV1yJv/iiA0MOTcm1M F6ylc9+rbiN5xdAGM/NMwAmr4LBSxNZuuVVvQAyrB3GltgMl9f8/M4zLOdZPq0UZLI/K FBioEFuM7VHuqSOC2oku9fQtqEgGfFNa1ghk35i2++dlLMvCJg38JWU1337jigTvKZ+S u2LW2Ru6o8LSqUYj6xFhOl+VJPexV0uYMajhGDtxttD0vUGdM6vGyXi8mDUYSXXycPGp XJBA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=ivPfFQfDMkc9CV9gkJn6cNL3QJqu24JbKny1J4yCyxE=; b=qiSpYa7Gu2ZQLL3vxPHgIVN6k6uEbf9I6FZKnI4530kizbaiWeRD3uP75ECXkecXzd WbSytirNTFociDNayUCfVH1fW9YlNai5OG2TJjCoHyzWsKFOf1JQzIjZILxUjlFYufYU Ep7J32ckIZ/IsHDwB1eDDVXNTGnVSclV4nJrGLYj+YCUo+XR2uL7mXW1whv4TQ8rRk1h LkhS1OH9og4mH/zHtRKz2+w7v/7kBLLgdcP9U/Eoyqt7MqDdBTb/o73o3e41/HokoPZl oIyf7NnPDHmUsUAlKXY5rqMbVmw4j717YGTbWi7RUbuT29ILO4rz4pIMIfvRch/ODj4W Ycgw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533vztAE+lltFhiXUzZ0GELtOB4UQmmg4dtX+g6UiDLfazEfw87j G9fJPd7VHetfEEHEUwjTTz1Pat1c4ZtURHcg5ptUQA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJy1TFb9Nww2T1fqyxlxpfLlN582ZHrQwPTecL1/uCOF0LPbosTqenE23qqP5tThDFdCCaxYkzKOn4scT8AGxf4= X-Received: by 2002:a37:404a:: with SMTP id n71mr9184878qka.330.1618581382265; Fri, 16 Apr 2021 06:56:22 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: "Russell O'Connor" Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2021 09:56:11 -0400 Message-ID: To: Christopher Gilliard , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000548f5805c017584a" Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] BIP - limiting OP_RETURN / HF X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2021 13:56:28 -0000 --000000000000548f5805c017584a Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Firstly, a minor point is that your proposal is a soft-fork, not a hard-fork. But more importantly, adding limitations on OP_RETURN transactions is not helpful. Users who want to embed arbitrary data in their transactions can always do so by encoding their data inside the values of legacy multi-signature scriptpubkeys (pubkeys can be generated without knowing the private key in order to encode non-key related data). Not only can users do this, users have done this in the past. However, this behaviour is problematic because such multi-signature "data" scriptpubkeys are indistinguishable from "real" multisignature scriptpubkeys, and thus must be kept in the UTXO set. This differs from outputs using OP_RETURN which are provably unspendable, and therefore can be safely omitted from the UTXO set. Thus, given that it is otherwise impossible to stop people from putting arbitrary data values into their transactions, then we rather encourage people who are going to encode their arbitrary data in transaction to use the OP_RETURN outputs in order to avoid UTXO bloat. Also, as it stands, fees already nudge various participants to consolidate their data in the way that you suggest they do. On Fri, Apr 16, 2021 at 9:32 AM Christopher Gilliard via bitcoin-dev < bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > I have created a BIP which can be found here: > https://github.com/cgilliard/bips/blob/notarization/bip-XXXX.mediawiki > > I'm sending this email to start the discussion regarding this proposal. If > there are any comments/suggestions, please let me know. > > Regards, > Chris > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > --000000000000548f5805c017584a Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Firstly, a minor point is that your proposal is a sof= t-fork, not a hard-fork.

But more importantly, add= ing limitations on OP_RETURN transactions is not helpful.=C2=A0 Users who w= ant to embed arbitrary data in their transactions can always do so by encod= ing their data inside the values of legacy multi-signature scriptpubkeys (p= ubkeys can be generated without knowing the private key in order to encode = non-key related data).=C2=A0 Not only can users do this, users have done th= is in the past.=C2=A0 However, this behaviour is problematic because such m= ulti-signature "data" scriptpubkeys are indistinguishable from &q= uot;real" multisignature scriptpubkeys, and thus must be kept in the U= TXO set.=C2=A0 This differs from outputs using OP_RETURN which are provably= unspendable, and therefore can be safely omitted from the UTXO set.
<= div>
Thus, given that it is otherwise impossible to stop peop= le from putting arbitrary data values into their transactions, then we rath= er encourage people who are going to encode their arbitrary data in transac= tion to use the OP_RETURN outputs in order to avoid UTXO bloat.
=
Also, as it stands, fees already nudge various participants = to consolidate their data in the way that you suggest they do.
On Fri, A= pr 16, 2021 at 9:32 AM Christopher Gilliard via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfounda= tion.org> wrote:
I have created a BIP which can be found here:=C2= =A0https://github.com/cgilliard/bips/blob/notariz= ation/bip-XXXX.mediawiki

I'm sending this email = to start the discussion regarding this proposal. If there are any comments/= suggestions, please let me know.

Regards,
Chris
_______________________________________________
bitcoin-dev mailing list
= bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mail= man/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
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