From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org (smtp4.osuosl.org [140.211.166.137]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93CB2C002D for ; Sat, 23 Jul 2022 05:10:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D2D342178 for ; Sat, 23 Jul 2022 05:10:35 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp4.osuosl.org 5D2D342178 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp4.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aiIAiO3g1can for ; Sat, 23 Jul 2022 05:10:34 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp4.osuosl.org 7F03B42176 Received: from mail-vk1-f179.google.com (mail-vk1-f179.google.com [209.85.221.179]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7F03B42176 for ; Sat, 23 Jul 2022 05:10:34 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-vk1-f179.google.com with SMTP id q125so333737vka.11 for ; Fri, 22 Jul 2022 22:10:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=RV0wy4rJD0x2XncHy9mVUD5JGBL0OO9gzpYUkgy80kA=; b=b+RkjJi+/iZRvhyXcPpzoYdpDm3oV2rZMFnuH2dHREw2xI4sq5sQOIHA2cl5XDssK2 eEuCxJfHeHh4T9Egjz+AsXnO3il0XUTW04HxlUUjzfETb1R1OsY9XnOY6jsvdacxBlQE 9pGSgDinTCl3GpP9Z0l4Qt8H6WX4mtgDdzB4gqbMaV1RJjr5yU/0JmhcxxcdjQvfua8y sHxLuT8RfOpgaAxXLHcTWmyNtVxuh+hFo9NZyiauMKOFGhIhkNCiA2KsOF4TWM2NxjYN 1D+HZrZaKWNP9woz+0wFLAP24J+W9Q3UUbOBuSzB4OohN9+BWXAP60BnA+67yyJliCfe ufMA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora9gBylvyFL4HrXWU1WOyy/fDJecfqr58bshnd50kAp64QbqApjv CmV8IeIf6gmXpvGU5aP3cqENzlxnO/DIjQOVBECjV7ju4/5Zy8qA X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1twtekpir6ckDHzXAItCcF9wZGL1rLNoNyXe70h48nidIfG4XKDYWPk1DXY0zCUJGvMmIWTlSFIG2MzBH8mkXs= X-Received: by 2002:a1f:ac50:0:b0:375:f4d4:9ace with SMTP id v77-20020a1fac50000000b00375f4d49acemr921278vke.36.1658553033036; Fri, 22 Jul 2022 22:10:33 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Ryan Grant Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2022 05:09:57 +0000 Message-ID: To: Antoine Riard , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] On a new community process to specify covenants X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2022 05:10:35 -0000 +1 I'd participate. Certain human/organizational limitations prevent things being said in logged channels that sometimes can be shared in person. Sometimes people break through misunderstandings in person, through either informal mingling or the use of Chatham House rules. So I would also advocate restarting the Scaling Bitcoin conferences, twice a year. One request for the agenda: I perceived a lot of "Oh, well it's also fine to just wait and see what comes" in the prior discussions. The idea that we should reopen this discussion presumes that it is better to not wait, because having even imperfect covenant designs will cause the ecosystem to explore what use cases to allocate developer interest in (as long as the fees are not too far off - yeah I'm looking at you, CSFS). Because of this, I also propose asking some of the more advanced scripting technologists to reveal what of their work is currently science, what is engineering, and what is product-oriented with understandable delivery dates. I think that if more people understood the answers to these questions then there would be more room for incremental exploration of the space.