From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com ([172.29.43.192] helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-1.v29.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1WddCO-0007xR-OW for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Fri, 25 Apr 2014 10:17:40 +0000 Received-SPF: pass (sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com: domain of gmail.com designates 209.85.214.171 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.214.171; envelope-from=mh.in.england@gmail.com; helo=mail-ob0-f171.google.com; Received: from mail-ob0-f171.google.com ([209.85.214.171]) by sog-mx-2.v43.ch3.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) id 1WddCO-0007vr-08 for bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net; Fri, 25 Apr 2014 10:17:40 +0000 Received: by mail-ob0-f171.google.com with SMTP id uy5so4032447obc.30 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2014 03:17:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.182.142.229 with SMTP id rz5mr6332307obb.12.1398421054648; Fri, 25 Apr 2014 03:17:34 -0700 (PDT) Sender: mh.in.england@gmail.com Received: by 10.76.96.180 with HTTP; Fri, 25 Apr 2014 03:17:34 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <5359E509.4080907@gmail.com> References: <5359E509.4080907@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2014 12:17:34 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: lqh76pXTcNBm72GWVup-0lrvyNI Message-ID: From: Mike Hearn To: Gareth Williams Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c362e635773d04f7db4606 X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam Filtering performed by mx.sourceforge.net. See http://spamassassin.org/tag/ for more details. -1.5 SPF_CHECK_PASS SPF reports sender host as permitted sender for sender-domain 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (mh.in.england[at]gmail.com) -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 1.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid -0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature X-Headers-End: 1WddCO-0007vr-08 Cc: Bitcoin Dev Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Coinbase reallocation to discourage Finney attacks X-BeenThere: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2014 10:17:40 -0000 --001a11c362e635773d04f7db4606 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > Proving that you can convince the economic majority that the > interpretation of existing blocks is in any way up for grabs would set a > dangerous precedent, and shake some people's faith in Bitcoin's overall > robustness and security (well, mine anyway.) Hmm, then I think your faith needs to be shaken. Bitcoin is money, and money is a purely artificial social construct. The interpretation of what a bitcoin means, or what a dollar means, has always been and always will be a human decision taken in order to achieve some socially useful goal. How could it be any other way? Do you want humanity to be enslaved by its own money? This notion that the block chain encodes some kind of natural, immovable law that's above human judgement is a very strange one to me - I guess it comes from the fact that encryption *is* based on some kind of natural law. Without the key you can't decrypt a message no matter how strong the consensus is. But Bitcoin doesn't use encryption anywhere, just digital signatures. The only thing approaching natural law, that stops majority consensus controlling everything, is lack of information. Hence all the discussion around privacy and anonymity that goes on all the time. --001a11c362e635773d04f7db4606 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Proving that you can convince the economic major= ity that the
interpretation of existing blocks is in any way up for grabs would set a dangerous precedent, and shake some people's faith in Bitcoin's ove= rall
robustness and security (well, mine anyway.)

Hmm, then I think your faith needs to be shaken. Bitcoin =C2=A0is money, = and money is a purely artificial social construct. The interpretation of wh= at a bitcoin means, or what a dollar means, has always been and always will= be a human decision taken in order to achieve some socially useful goal. H= ow could it be any other way? Do you want humanity to be enslaved by its ow= n money?

This notion that the block chain encodes some kind of n= atural, immovable law that's above human judgement is a very strange on= e to me - I guess it comes from the fact that encryption is=C2=A0bas= ed on some kind of natural law. Without the key you can't decrypt a mes= sage no matter how strong the consensus is. But Bitcoin doesn't use enc= ryption anywhere, just digital signatures. The only thing approaching natur= al law, that stops majority consensus controlling everything, is lack of in= formation. Hence all the discussion around privacy and anonymity that goes = on all the time.
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