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[2a00:1450:4864:20::62a]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 2adb3069b0e04-5439af75c6bsi46094e87.9.2025.01.17.02.38.39 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 17 Jan 2025 02:38:39 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: none (google.com: kalle@rosenbaum.se does not designate permitted sender hosts) client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::62a; Received: by mail-ej1-x62a.google.com with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-aaecf50578eso405723366b.2 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2025 02:38:39 -0800 (PST) X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCXRIFJ3v/9/Xuua7baKJHCNHrYQHgDbRBu7MsiGsPZ/5Z5ec9OacYnSkizp8BJB6+rSHMfbo1jyAftU@googlegroups.com X-Gm-Gg: ASbGnctIZdZj1h5G914P1w17NAEe5Lt1kPf31gayP8FBW/q1Wt3ylimYf7fweCEl5KK l7pUesuefL5LgRZROCbs/hw2V3jaOs69un46TV4U= X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:948b:b0:aaf:f32:cce2 with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-ab38b38138cmr197980666b.37.1737110318958; Fri, 17 Jan 2025 02:38:38 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <6FDAD97F-7C5F-474B-9EE6-82092C9073C5@sprovoost.nl> In-Reply-To: From: Kalle Rosenbaum Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2025 11:38:28 +0100 X-Gm-Features: AbW1kvb9NuTyzWUF9iKLTribS8yYENgkB6CdNgof0syS_aj29pPRpWalJu7aWNE Message-ID: Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] Who uses or wants to use PSBTv2 (BIP370) To: Salvatore Ingala Cc: Sjors Provoost , bitcoindev@googlegroups.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000007f6d29062be4835b" X-Original-Sender: kalle@rosenbaum.se X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@rosenbaum-se.20230601.gappssmtp.com header.s=20230601 header.b=AkP9M3q5; spf=none (google.com: kalle@rosenbaum.se does not designate permitted sender hosts) smtp.mailfrom=kalle@rosenbaum.se; dara=pass header.i=@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; contact bitcoindev+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 786775582512 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) --0000000000007f6d29062be4835b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I might have linked to a slightly outdated version of ledger's psbtv2. I haven't been involved lately. The correct one could be https://github.com/LedgerHQ/app-bitcoin-new/blob/53dfd1727ab55182f9e365747b26b862e48b7b8b/bitcoin_client_js/src/lib/psbtv2.ts. Is that right, Salvatore? /Kalle On Fri, 17 Jan 2025 at 11:03, Salvatore Ingala wrote: > Hi Sjors, > > The Ledger Bitcoin app uses PSBTv2 since version 2.0.0 in 2021 [0], quite > possibly the first adopter - although for somewhat unusual reasons. > > Working with embedded devices with just a few kb of RAM, even sending the > entire PSBT is not generally feasible. > Therefore, the client instead sends a 'merkleized' commitment to the > entire PSBT at the beginning of the signing process. > This enables the device to obtain random access to the PSBT by querying > the client (who provides the data - and the Merkle proof - on demand). > > In PsbtV0, the unsigned transaction is a binary blob, which was a huge > headache because the device had to parse it while streaming it (and > therefore, no RAM access to the individual transaction fields is possible). > PsbtV2 fixed this by having the transaction already 'parsed' into > individual fields. > > The companion client libraries of the Ledger Bitcoin app support both > versions, and PsbtV0 is converted to PsbtV2 on the fly. > Broader support would certainly be useful. > > Best, > Salvatore Ingala > > [0] https://www.ledger.com/blog/bitcoin-2 > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/CAMhCMoGONKFok_SuZkic%2BT%3DyoWZs5eeVxtwJL6Ei%3DyysvA8rrg%40mail.gmail.com > > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/CAPswA9xbtbEfj-QmnAXj1m1R%2BGap-Bd9vs8ed1ueA5gGtD-pYw%40mail.gmail.com. --0000000000007f6d29062be4835b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I might have linked to a slightly outdated version of ledg= er's psbtv2. I haven't been involved lately. The correct one could = be=C2=A0http= s://github.com/LedgerHQ/app-bitcoin-new/blob/53dfd1727ab55182f9e365747b26b8= 62e48b7b8b/bitcoin_client_js/src/lib/psbtv2.ts. Is that right, Salvator= e?

/Kalle

=
On Fri, 17 Jan 2025 at 11:03, Salvato= re Ingala <salvatore.ingal= a@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi=C2=A0Sjors,

<= div>The Ledger Bitcoin app uses PSBTv2 since version 2.0.0 in 2021 [0], qui= te possibly the first adopter - although for somewhat unusual reasons.

Working with embedded devices with just a few kb of RA= M, even sending the entire PSBT is not generally feasible.
Therefore, th= e client instead sends a 'merkleized' commitment to the entire PSBT= at the beginning of the signing process.
This enables the device= to obtain random access to the PSBT by querying the client (who provides t= he data - and the Merkle proof - on demand).

In PsbtV0, the unsigned= transaction is a binary blob, which was a huge headache because the device= had to=C2=A0parse it while streaming it (and therefore, no RAM access to t= he individual transaction fields is possible).
PsbtV2 fixed this by havi= ng the transaction already 'parsed' into individual fields.

The companion client libraries of the Ledger Bitcoi= n app support both versions, and PsbtV0 is converted to PsbtV2 on the fly.<= /div>
Broader support would certainly be useful.

Best,
Salvatore Ingala

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