From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org (smtp4.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::137]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D2B2C002A; Sun, 30 Apr 2023 15:22:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3187741871; Sun, 30 Apr 2023 15:22:08 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp4.osuosl.org 3187741871 Authentication-Results: smtp4.osuosl.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=20221208 header.b=lHXi84g7 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from smtp4.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp4.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id x0XmB-AFYLjQ; Sun, 30 Apr 2023 15:22:07 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 smtp4.osuosl.org CFF0D4186D X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 Received: from mail-lf1-x12c.google.com (mail-lf1-x12c.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::12c]) by smtp4.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CFF0D4186D; Sun, 30 Apr 2023 15:22:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-lf1-x12c.google.com with SMTP id 2adb3069b0e04-4f004943558so2083687e87.3; Sun, 30 Apr 2023 08:22:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20221208; t=1682868124; x=1685460124; h=in-reply-to:references:to:from:subject:cc:message-id:date :content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=RKeITHO3Mr3zy5iULvdhATjflBdZuDYTuzwwKTCbWvQ=; b=lHXi84g7eCs984d3AapJ7iDC42lHoKOtksCKzo35P0hruo+tyxUbEFxSMa3zDwo6BR 8MSlHXYZZc8JaLflt9KPI+/LvEvzW4gGsQoEQVN8YxS7wYgtqFWq1znhh/z6qcd2Z5bo sCbAgOlMnqivY9KoExLnj9SJp8a+LX37Q3PH8p3XEzXK/M13XCYcQEj2L+zIHm9CACof KOhGFDbLtmT23ovGAy9w/+j2SHHy8AO9ZuIbHKX1bheruWZ/dDYRMPcLyU9luoaoZBU1 ElIero4ru0ikGHEhNPy2C1YMbFWIBZap7qGQcUnRYq8ttXBkA+dJURlxZCjga8dfeFu7 VUuA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20221208; t=1682868124; x=1685460124; h=in-reply-to:references:to:from:subject:cc:message-id:date :content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to :cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=RKeITHO3Mr3zy5iULvdhATjflBdZuDYTuzwwKTCbWvQ=; b=QksFZtf4p48JmujcdbyYGoeQQ7AESgiwLSK35xJBC63jAnQcT2civBSlXW3N61uaTB Iq+tWZ3W3ojqfg0vG18SX3Wdj1qj7rUQp28CNnkzl3XYHuK4zxVUu9ICYCEhXf5ZvFxQ KKnpvIQ4PBX4EAvlmU9DLnT9maXCX1zLHH5E4PhomB+1yn/bzQmZZCQLYYheZ7n9TCfc D/E2qsAUkVIA2sEmIjNyBR7oKxjHvPcFUlw8kooEOqTMU/xxTFJq+SEfJkJ07nO1d1mP nb13B/vhzIHkeaCKQ1u4t1kgXwWssHkswPllBVnrcK7kI/xWu+r6D+zYtgvzfu+zV82u YOMg== X-Gm-Message-State: AC+VfDxXZ6iBIR1Vt7Vxj1TLF4wAiNZ97HmyQ2mwWA5/sxAFMZEVu0vK EdHuW1wd6iHO/ymgjDQu4FU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ACHHUZ5aE01aoaWiMSqSsV9shPfgnQmgGVOxePjK8PJbAFMuiwo3XoIN6kalJB5OD8lJeA9uthvtZw== X-Received: by 2002:ac2:4904:0:b0:4b5:9b8f:cc82 with SMTP id n4-20020ac24904000000b004b59b8fcc82mr3190353lfi.0.1682868124185; Sun, 30 Apr 2023 08:22:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost ([165.231.178.21]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a16-20020ac25210000000b004eb252e3eb5sm2002316lfl.135.2023.04.30.08.22.02 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 30 Apr 2023 08:22:03 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2023 17:22:01 +0200 Message-Id: From: "Vincenzo Palazzo" To: "niftynei" , "Bitcoin Protocol Discussion" , "Michael Folkson" X-Mailer: aerc 0.14.0 References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 30 Apr 2023 20:45:46 +0000 Cc: Lightning Dev Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] A new Bitcoin implementation integrated with Core Lightning X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2023 15:22:08 -0000 Hi Michael and Lisa, > Hi Michael, > > CLN as implemented is currently nicely decoupled from the block source; a= s > a project we assume that the node runner will choose a block backend that > fits their self-sovereignty goals. > > This provides us with a nice separation of concerns. The block source is > responsible for ensuring that only consensus valid data is delivered to t= he > node, which in turn allows us to focus on processing and reacting to that > data, as necessary. Let me just mention that [1] I have been working on a plugin=20 that allows experimentation with different types of Bitcoin Core=20 node alternatives (including core too), and it also supports BIP 157=20 with nakamoto [2]. In the upcoming months, I plan to allocate some time to work=20 directly on Nakamoto. > There=E2=80=99s probably a real opportunity to =E2=80=9Ccomingle=E2=80=9D= the peering of LN gossip > + block data networks, this has been suggested a few times but never > seriously pursued from the LN side. Having the peering functions of > bitcoin-core broken out into a more composable/reusable piece may be a go= od > first step here, and as a project would largely be on the bitcoin core > side. Maybe this work is already in progress? I havent been keeping up wi= th > developments there. A missing piece at the moment is a unified approach to fee calculation.=20 This logic is critical for Lightning nodes, so if we don't have a uniform= =20 way of estimating fees, it could lead to several issues. P.S: The fee estimation problem may have already been solved by Neutrino,= =20 but I'm not aware of it. [1] https://github.com/coffee-tools/folgore [2] https://github.com/cloudhead/nakamoto Cheers! Vincent.