From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9FF67727 for ; Fri, 24 Jul 2015 01:26:03 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: from auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from st11p02im-asmtp002.me.com (st11p02im-asmtp002.me.com [17.172.220.114]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 03F2012A for ; Fri, 24 Jul 2015 01:26:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [10.52.6.2] (unknown [101.78.135.131]) by st11p02im-asmtp002.me.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 7.0.5.35.0 64bit (built Mar 31 2015)) with ESMTPSA id <0NRY007EQXBAEG20@st11p02im-asmtp002.me.com> for bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org; Fri, 24 Jul 2015 01:26:02 +0000 (GMT) X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10432:5.14.151,1.0.33,0.0.0000 definitions=2015-07-24_01:2015-07-22, 2015-07-23, 1970-01-01 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 spamscore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 adultscore=0 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=7.0.1-1412110000 definitions=main-1507240017 Sun-Java-System-SMTP-Warning: Lines longer than SMTP allows found and wrapped. Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 MIME-version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Jean-Paul Kogelman X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (12H143) In-reply-to: Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2015 09:25:57 +0800 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Message-id: References: <55B113AF.40500@thinlink.com> <6F436293-9E2B-461C-B105-FC4CF9EBFC69@gmail.com> <42BF7FEB-320F-43BE-B3D9-1D76CB8B9975@gmai> <346D4CE0-E00D-4ABB-B131-EFA1416CB20C@me.com> <29363BE6-72A7-4D06-A974-C52BA12FD8BD@gmail.com> <55FFBC8F-A3C9-4109-89C7-AC359FBBD478@me.com> <4734381C-2000-4D9B-9099-DDE3D38D64A3@me.com> To: Eric Lombrozo X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,MIME_QP_LONG_LINE, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW,RP_MATCHES_RCVD autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org Cc: Jean-Paul Kogelman via bitcoin-dev Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Bitcoin Core and hard forks X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2015 01:26:03 -0000 I think implicit QoS is far simpler to implement, requires less parties and i= s closer to what Bitcoin started out as: a peer-to-peer digital cash system,= not a peer-to-let-me-handle-that-for-you-to-peer system. jp > On Jul 24, 2015, at 9:08 AM, Eric Lombrozo wrote: >=20 > By using third parties separate from individual miners that do bidding on y= our behalf you get a mechanism that allows QoS guarantees and shifting the c= omplexity and risk from the wallet with little computational resources to a s= ervice with abundance of them. Using timelocked contracts it=A1=AFs possible= to enforce the guarantees. >=20 > Negotiating directly with miners via smart contracts seems difficult at be= st. >=20 >=20 >> On Jul 23, 2015, at 6:03 PM, Jean-Paul Kogelman via bitcoin-dev wrote: >>=20 >> Doesn't matter. >>=20 >> It's not going to be perfect given the block time variance among other fa= ctors but it's far more workable than guessing whether or not your transacti= on is going to end up in a block at all. >>=20 >> jp >>=20 >>=20 >>> On Jul 24, 2015, at 8:53 AM, Peter Todd wrote: >>>=20 >>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >>> Hash: SHA256 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>> On 23 July 2015 20:49:20 GMT-04:00, Jean-Paul Kogelman via bitcoin-dev <= bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> And it's obvious how a size cap would interfere with such a QoS scheme.= >>>> Miners wouldn't be able to deliver the below guarantees if they have to= >>>> start excluding transactions. >>>=20 >>> As mining is a random, poisson process, obviously giving guarantees with= out a majority of hashing power isn't possible. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >>>=20 >>> iQE9BAEBCAAnIBxQZXRlciBUb2RkIDxwZXRlQHBldGVydG9kZC5vcmc+BQJVsYyK >>> AAoJEMCF8hzn9Lnc47AH/28WlecQLb37CiJpcvXO9tC4zqYEodurtB9nBHTSJrug >>> VIEXZW53pSTdd3vv2qpGIlHxuYP8QmDSATztwQLuN6XWEszz7TO8MXBfLxKqZyGu >>> i83WqSGjMAfwqjl0xR1G7PJgt4+E+0vaAFZc98vLCgZnedbiXRVtTGjhofG1jjTc >>> DFMwMZHP0eqWTwtWwqUvnA7PTFHxdqoJruY/t1KceN+JDbBCJWMxBDswU64FXcVH >>> 0ecsk9nhLMyylBX/2v4HjCXyayocH8jQ+FpLSP0xxERyS+f1npFX9cxFMq24uXqn >>> PcnZfLfaSJ6gMbmhbYG5wYDKN3u732j7dLzSJnMW6jk=3D >>> =3DLY1+ >>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- >> _______________________________________________ >> bitcoin-dev mailing list >> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org >> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev >=20