From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from fraxinus.osuosl.org (smtp4.osuosl.org [140.211.166.137]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF8E2C087F for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2019 21:10:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fraxinus.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C779885D8D for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2019 21:10:30 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org Received: from fraxinus.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9ahkgTEGrkZK for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2019 21:10:29 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: domain auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.7.6 Received: from mail-40130.protonmail.ch (mail-40130.protonmail.ch [185.70.40.130]) by fraxinus.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BBDE185D41 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2019 21:10:28 +0000 (UTC) Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2019 21:10:19 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=protonmail.com; s=default; t=1575321025; bh=Epd+HtyVGB4sSHfWA+9dNLo5fsjxgRhz3EsNBC2bCJY=; h=Date:To:From:Reply-To:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Feedback-ID: From; b=Rp774MDQWcgJzXKDCbY20UyVE5Byn00Ufm2kuy1NQ+MlqSaDXQxAoIggdvUXG8v7Y WAFzfB0326yfWwz26ViNgytAtR4myEGucXgsiXFmTCz2g7fFCrNoMM1PRUxdNZUDLF kQEd4QPldfoyT42I1hl+z2GqZWFZ/z3JOEneDLE0= To: Tim Blokdijk , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion From: ZmnSCPxj Reply-To: ZmnSCPxj Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <55cb9731-e7fb-0bfa-0cba-391ff81d263a@timblokdijk.nl> References: <55cb9731-e7fb-0bfa-0cba-391ff81d263a@timblokdijk.nl> Feedback-ID: el4j0RWPRERue64lIQeq9Y2FP-mdB86tFqjmrJyEPR9VAtMovPEo9tvgA0CrTsSHJeeyPXqnoAu6DN-R04uJUg==:Ext:ProtonMail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] easypaysy - A layer-two protocol to send payments without addresses X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2019 21:10:31 -0000 Good morning Tim, and Jose, > Just a quick question, this is fully decentralized? > It broadcasts information over `OP_RETURN` on the blockchain layer, thus de= centralized as long as the blockchain layer is decentralized. It also means that to register an account, you need to either own some Bitc= oins, or rent some Bitcoins to serve as signalling (and then potentially ha= ve to change your account identifier later when the lease expires). `OP_RETURN` does have size limits (imposed by `isStandard`), I do not remem= ber exact numbers, and any data would need to fit. Finally, use of the blockchain layer is costly; given that payees must be o= nline at any time payers wish to pay, it may do better to just use Lightnin= g instead, which has the same requirement, but moves payments to a separate= layer as well, and requires only a single onchain transaction to construct= a channel (easypaysy seems to require at least 2, one to anchor the accoun= t pubkeys, the other to give the basic "activation" information for the acc= ount). It may be useful to consider defiads, which does *not* use `OP_RETURN`, but= instead uses pay-to-contract, and sends the advertisement data over a sepa= rate overlay network. The use-case is mildly different, but ultimately defiads is about connectin= g potential buyers to potential sellers, and sending data about how to get = paid would have to be part and parcel of how defiads ultimately works. Also, one of the contact-information protocols supported should probably be= Tor hidden services, instead of `https`. Tor hidden services have better useability (no need for port forwarding or = registering DNS from some centralized service), with privacy as a bonus. Further it seems insufficient to only encode block and tx index. I think it should also encode output index, to also allow a single transact= ion to anchor multiple accounts. Also consider using the Lightning encoding of identifying an output: 543847= x636x2 Regards, ZmnSCPxj > Greetings, > > Tim Blokdijk > > Op 02-12-19 om 15:00 schreef Jose Femenias via bitcoin-dev: > > > Hi, > > > > I have just released an early preview of easypaysy, a protocol for Bitc= oin, that I have been working on for the past few months. > > > > (In case you are wondering, easypaysy stands for EASY - PAYment- SYstem= ...) > > > > Long story short, easypaysy is a layer-two protocol that allows the cre= ation of non-custodial accounts directly on the blockchain, so that bitcoin= addresses can fully disappear from the user experience. > > In lieu of addresses, users send payments to permanent account IDs. > > > > Account IDs are implicitly assigned by the mining process, and come in = several flavors, like in these examples: > > > > Canonical ID:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 btc@543847.636/577 > > Mnemonic ID:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 btc@cancel-mind.exhibit/motion > > Domain ID:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 btc@example.com/motion-custom > > > > (Note: Domain IDs are optional and require extra configuration) > > > > The protocol allows both interactive and non interactive payments. > > All payments are non-repudiable, and it is possible to implement pull-p= ayments as well as chargebacks. > > > > Most of the protocol is quite advanced, but I have refrained from speci= fying some of the details, until the interested parties can give their feed= back. > > > > For more information, you can see the white paper and a short introduct= ory video at: > > > > https://www.easypaysy.org > > > > or directly, by following these links: > > > > White paper at https://www.easypaysy.org/assets/easypaysy_white_paper.p= df > > Introductory video at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DAOGBdyZbyoA > > > > You can also get in contact with me in at: > > > > jose.femenias@gmail.com > > > > or using the project's email at: > > > > easypaysy@gmail.com > > > > Best regards. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > bitcoin-dev mailing list > > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev