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Harding" Cc: Martin =?utf-8?Q?Habov=C5=A1tiak?= , bitcoindev@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] Anyone can boost - a more efficient alternative to anchor outputs Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="yxWKrjku4KWp2xBC" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Original-Sender: pete@petertodd.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=JbnVmsd5; spf=pass (google.com: domain of pete@petertodd.org designates 64.147.123.20 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=pete@petertodd.org Precedence: list Mailing-list: list bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; contact bitcoindev+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 786775582512 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: -0.8 (/) --yxWKrjku4KWp2xBC Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Disposition: inline On Sun, Mar 24, 2024 at 03:36:30PM -1000, David A. Harding wrote: > On 2024-03-19 04:24, Peter Todd wrote: > > To reduce trust you could do an automated, multiple round, signing > > scheme where > > the service signs transations with higher and higher fee-rates in > > exchange for > > most funds over LN. > > When the service thinks the user has paid all that they're going to pay, > what stops them from replacing their transaction one more time with a > version that does not sponsor the user's transaction? That at least is mitigated a bit by the fact that the earlier versions existed and were valid; it's still a potentially useful reduction in trust as the service needs to be able to do something economically useful with the high-fee transaction for it to be a profitable attack. As I said, I'm suggesting a way to reduce trust. Not eliminate it. > Also, what stops the > service from selling the same space in a sponsor transaction to multiple > users at once, e.g. customers Alice and Bob each iterate with the service > many times until they get a sponsor with as much fee as they want, but when > they go to broadcast, they discover that their transactions conflict, so one > of them paid for nothing? That might actually be a weaker attack than the first: you can watch a mempool, unknown to the service, to see if you recieve the transaction you paid for. If you don't, there's a reasonable chance they're trying to rip you off. -- https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/ZgQPJgXXFOuxVTkV%40petertodd.org. --yxWKrjku4KWp2xBC Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEE0RcYcKRzsEwFZ3N5Lly11TVRLzcFAmYEDyUACgkQLly11TVR LzfyjQ//WM6XyS45Rj4bBdWvzkJe/S3T2xmjHOYgh3fmpO0Cdiy3A3C+zd11Ln7r j9CBmyluq6ppT9k/ln7Ht0Kp2u4DerC/E9aMgd/KfRiq++OZD+f3HLsVSeA/BqQg mIhgNrnVWhd4HV1H1PT9mpp6IJgPmnvUTh7U7SU29DSh1eZcHGek4vG+VH4oLXF3 k9d+jlJkf2UQFYCMWxW/A4U9e+UyqxwfwAB5cOWtk9Aq1RmkV8YSnwC5QUnRwquj FI1Ikw7boU33i01PQUhVvv47r95He/rk+jOb+I7/Xdw8fMDaUl9MW0JHl57j0Pes NhRPafHcfDkMJWwX2ggR4l+GFA5fD84qZG4N5wuqltenN+HnIncYPvZQfJnb3O2Q S96XeeyP4M+0BkHxgTTCHSH9jnUzmoROcHC1VLQybpR0ORzKwnP96B6ymIk6WjzO +w5eMqR9I7wCkwksSKzzT1GNPl5M6I24VzIC6jIn1iHrhyqB7SfsABcrx+rNH4Jb Dpms9wcKY4ziW1OsMgZSDOjtmqdlvUXvB3ie61gHcaf624gTPAbopqgrGSpILlTc IBDwDN3XtuARH6GdUqNKABT2evEl1i5X4gRFT5MHAsEowd+RfAdh5LwgX3dyYOIw MgxOv7XFZx8kVvLRUIUwbBqF+6qD+nY3nX110GdqaFhrV7pK0DY= =UZxa -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --yxWKrjku4KWp2xBC--