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[202.12.124.152]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id d75a77b69052e-4a608fefae1si5514001cf.0.2025.06.11.10.28.57 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 11 Jun 2025 10:28:57 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of pete@petertodd.org designates 202.12.124.152 as permitted sender) client-ip=202.12.124.152; Received: from phl-compute-02.internal (phl-compute-02.phl.internal [10.202.2.42]) by mailfhigh.stl.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 358FE25401EB; Wed, 11 Jun 2025 13:28:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from phl-mailfrontend-01 ([10.202.2.162]) by phl-compute-02.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 11 Jun 2025 13:28:57 -0400 X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeeffedrtddugdduvdejlecutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpggftfghnshhusghstghrihgsvgdp uffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivg hnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenucfjughrpeffhffvvefukfhfgggtuggjsehgtderredttddv necuhfhrohhmpefrvghtvghrucfvohguugcuoehpvghtvgesphgvthgvrhhtohguugdroh hrgheqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhepledvleelffdtudekudffjefgfeejueehieelfedt gfetudetgeegveeutefhjedtnecuffhomhgrihhnpehpvghtvghrthhouggurdhorhhgne cuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomhepphgvthgv sehpvghtvghrthhouggurdhorhhgpdhnsggprhgtphhtthhopeehpdhmohguvgepshhmth hpohhuthdprhgtphhtthhopegurghvvgesughtrhhtrdhorhhgpdhrtghpthhtohepjhgr mhgvshdrohgsvghirhhnvgesghhmrghilhdrtghomhdprhgtphhtthhopegsihhttghoih hnuggvvhesghhoohhglhgvghhrohhuphhsrdgtohhmpdhrtghpthhtoheplhhfqdhlihhs thhssehmrghtthgtohhrrghllhhordgtohhmpdhrtghpthhtoheprghpohgvlhhsthhrrg esfihpshhofhhtfigrrhgvrdhnvght X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: i525146e8:Fastmail Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Wed, 11 Jun 2025 13:28:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: by localhost (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 5CC8EA4CF5; Wed, 11 Jun 2025 13:52:18 +0000 (UTC) Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2025 13:52:18 +0000 From: Peter Todd To: Matt Corallo Cc: Andrew Poelstra , "David A. Harding" , James O'Beirne , Bitcoin Development Mailing List Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] CTV + CSFS: a letter Message-ID: References: <195051b7c393b9a28727e87647ac002b@dtrt.org> <1147a254-5033-4663-99f0-7e98a5b6b6c0@mattcorallo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="0EiCy4X+TKNfUx2n" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1147a254-5033-4663-99f0-7e98a5b6b6c0@mattcorallo.com> X-Original-Sender: pete@petertodd.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@messagingengine.com header.s=fm1 header.b=WkOCLMZ1; spf=pass (google.com: domain of pete@petertodd.org designates 202.12.124.152 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=pete@petertodd.org Precedence: list Mailing-list: list bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; contact bitcoindev+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 786775582512 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: 1.6 (+) --0EiCy4X+TKNfUx2n Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Disposition: inline On Tue, Jun 10, 2025 at 01:17:07PM -0400, Matt Corallo wrote: > The relay changes you mention but sweep under the rug are a critical > improvement to the security model and usability of lightning, a > widely-deployed and now highly utilized critical piece of bitcoin (Cash > App's public numbers from the Vegas conference indicate its about 25% of > their withdraw volume by count!). The relay changes are also very important to to future L2 designs too. E.g. if Ark is to be actually be a non-custodial L2 where unilateral withdrawal actually works, it needs to be able to avoid transaction pinning and flexibly pay for transaction fees at least as much as Lightning does. -- https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/aEmKEpGbPJeWQ75Z%40petertodd.org. --0EiCy4X+TKNfUx2n Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEE0RcYcKRzsEwFZ3N5Lly11TVRLzcFAmhJig4ACgkQLly11TVR Lzdt+w//WLKDzEp3Eq3JwjUQN6AvIKDJlhlAyBZ3JAnsETKDkr4JeS+XY5ZOJdsn 1JgbvAZM1k4h+shl4eB4D5YUfL7tun/CI4JKjnHq0eNDT4k6RbC5nFIDG+GS73QC MAHK+PdniY/TGFByCPuSaK1m7A2Brb3Izii7qVV0fSrGJrMyWtip3Ul4IOPnUEDf w3n5IJimLwl9LNfCvBrBzSBm/DdkxKbXmPzlIjyhKqhuooNCYycd0Lp6f9Ijzq8u ObPab0Ycg/jewUlMLsyzD5nazhvxH8ndpNn72JEBgg2DJGz3iJgeUwRoLKbbkHRI Sat/eC1sNlpiQ+0pc/9qVdHBonb6cy+l1sgAjzdSoGKD43ZFSmPjOn9mPscNRzFd 3x2apyIRd4/E9XqzqNqcLq9fF1720b/uRxQvRiqbY+2aucI6xsAE7QDG+TeQK2Gv b3tKNyGgwc44uKnrPZVZZA71fdI+7I/MBACMGwRKtFcezP1HC7Lj07zgqJ0NbNGx O/eC1l9SvwUByp8+UV9aOwXaw5UENHSNY7GTQSO6ScATw9ICiTNj+wKzqj2D30Q8 RGzs8U6Me3B+JUTzj0YiAibvsEEbrwQlD2nk3lpRqe0itxFzPBnjpLdH37E89mqe J+jCtUkiKRUvuvG8UWn2rlK86ywdesaeWlZKxg7BSX4wUfb0Of0= =S1lX -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --0EiCy4X+TKNfUx2n--