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[76.167.237.202]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id rb8sm20576556pbb.63.2015.09.20.15.22.00 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 20 Sep 2015 15:22:00 -0700 (PDT) From: "Eric Lombrozo" <elombrozo@gmail.com> To: "Milly Bitcoin" <milly@bitcoins.info>, bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2015 22:21:55 +0000 Message-Id: <eme6e53f4a-40c6-4b6f-8cf1-b2e8d9905e9d@platinum> In-Reply-To: <55FF2CF8.2010408@bitcoins.info> Reply-To: "Eric Lombrozo" <elombrozo@gmail.com> User-Agent: eM_Client/6.0.23181.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU, FREEMAIL_FROM, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on smtp1.linux-foundation.org Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Scaling Bitcoin conference micro-report X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Development Discussion <bitcoin-dev.lists.linuxfoundation.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/options/bitcoin-dev>, <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/> List-Post: <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> List-Help: <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>, <mailto:bitcoin-dev-request@lists.linuxfoundation.org?subject=subscribe> X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2015 22:22:02 -0000 ------ Original Message ------ From: "Milly Bitcoin via bitcoin-dev"=20 <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> To: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org Sent: 9/20/2015 3:02:32 PM Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Scaling Bitcoin conference micro-report >>Larger user base won't necessarily protect against governments if we >>still have chokepoints they can go after. > > >Bitcoin will always have chokepoints governments can go after. Hackers= =20 >already targeted routers to divert mining traffic awhile back. Bitcoin= =20 >traffic is easily seen and blocked by ISP's. It has already been=20 >pointed out that laws against merchants and exchanges cannot be=20 >defended against any other way than to have many people use the system. Almost none of these merchants depend on Bitcoin in any significant way=20 for revenue...and that's likely to remain the case for a good while.=20 Merchants that have chosen to accept Bitcoin are typically using a=20 handful of payment processors, again...chokepoints. And almost none of=20 them are contributing any network resources back to Bitcoin. Exchanges are indeed serious chokepoints. But increasing the number of=20 users will probably have relatively little effect on this unless we also= =20 increase the number of exchanges and decentralize the exchanges. If all=20 we had to do is increase the number of users, the same argument could be= =20 used to claim that banks would be less susceptible to governmental=20 crackdowns if they just had more account holders. Exchange decentralization is indeed another thing we must work towards -= =20 but that's probably beyond the scope of the more pressing issue which is= =20 building consensus in Bitcoin development. >(As a developer you, of course, did not mention the threat of having a=20 >tiny number of developers who have significant influence over Bitcoin. = =20 >It always amazes me the endless discussion over miners centralization=20 >and almost zero discussion of developer decentralization.) I've pointed out this weakness of Bitcoin *numerous* times. That I=20 failed to mention it here does not mean it hasn't been discussed=20 elsewhere. Some of us have also been actively working towards developing= =20 a more modular, layered architecture and better implementations that=20 will afford greater decentralization in software development with less=20 need for critical code reviews, less pushback from downstream developers= =20 who must continuously rebase, a better process for building consensus in= =20 the community, and simpler app migration. > > >Increasing the nodes by a factor of 2 or 3 or keeping the block size=20 >small to increase the diversity of miners by a few percent will have=20 >zero effect if those other government threats were to actually happen. > We need to increase the basic infrastructure nodes by a factor much=20 larger than 2 or 3...more like 100 or 1000...and it's entirely doable=20 with properly aligned incentives. >Russ > > >_______________________________________________ >bitcoin-dev mailing list >bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org >https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev