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From: Andreas Schildbach <andreas@schildbach.de>
To: bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] moving the default display to mbtc
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 16:56:23 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <lfv8qp$a2v$1@ger.gmane.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CANEZrP2AtfkiNG4--8rF8C73N=Hf_UR+9DzPAWESSfu95KCwiw@mail.gmail.com>

Indeed, rounding is the obvious easy fix. Bitcoin Wallet rounds all
amounts except if you type amounts with a higher precision.


On 03/14/2014 04:32 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
> The issue here is that most people are producing prices in BTC by just
> multiplying through the spot rate with full precision. Obviously if you
> converted dollar prices to Euro prices with the same technique, you'd
> also end up with lots of numbers after the decimal point, but in the
> real world nobody actually does this. They always "prettify" the price.
> 
> This practice often annoys people because they feel like they get short
> changed. The most notorious example is Apple which likes (liked?) to
> charge 99 cents per iTunes song in the USA, and 99 pennies per song in
> the UK, despite that the British pound is worth a lot more than the
> dollar. It should be more like 60 pence.
> 
> Nothing stops BitPay rounding the mBTC price to look more natural, but
> right now it's not common practice.
> 
> 
> On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 4:02 PM, Andreas Schildbach
> <andreas@schildbach.de <mailto:andreas@schildbach.de>> wrote:
> 
>     By that definition 3.56 is a price. Maybe I misunderstood you and you're
>     lobbying for mBTC?
> 
> 
>     On 03/14/2014 03:57 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:
>     > you miss the point Andreas. It is not about the magnitude but about
>     > the form of a price.
>     >
>     > A number with no decimals or with two decimals is percieved as a
>     > price in some currency.
>     >
>     > A number with more than two decimals is just not percieved as a price
>     > but as a geeky something that you rather convert to local currency.
>     >
>     > Tamas Blummer
>     > Bits of Proof
>     >
>     > On 14.03.2014, at 15:49, Andreas Schildbach <andreas@schildbach.de
>     <mailto:andreas@schildbach.de>
>     > <mailto:andreas@schildbach.de <mailto:andreas@schildbach.de>>> wrote:
>     >
>     >> How much do you pay for an Espresso in your local currency?
>     >>
>     >> At least for the Euro and the Dollar, mBTC 3.56 is very close to what
>     >> people would expect. Certainly more familiar than µBTC 3558 or BTC
>     >> 0.003578.
>     >>
>     >> Anyway, I was just sharing real-world experience: nobody is confused.
>     >>
>     >>
>     >> On 03/14/2014 03:14 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:
>     >>> You give them a hard to interpret thing like mBTC and then wonder
>     >>> why they rather look at local currency. Because the choices you
>     >>> gave them are bad.
>     >>>
>     >>> I think Bitcoin would have a better chance to be percieved as a
>     >>> currency of its own if it had prices and fractions like currencies
>     >>> do.
>     >>>
>     >>> 3.558 mBTC or 0.003578 BTC will never be as accepted as 3558 bits
>     >>> would be.
>     >>>
>     >>>
>     >>> Tamas Blummer Bits of Proof
>     >>>
>     >>> On 14.03.2014, at 15:05, Andreas Schildbach
>     <andreas@schildbach.de <mailto:andreas@schildbach.de>
>     >>> <mailto:andreas@schildbach.de <mailto:andreas@schildbach.de>>>
>     >>> wrote:
>     >>>
>     >>>> btw. None of Bitcoin Wallet's users complained about confusion
>     >>>> because of the mBTC switch. In contrast, I get many mails and
>     >>>> questions if exchange rates happen to differ by >10%.
>     >>>>
>     >>>> I suspect nobody looks at the Bitcoin price. It's the amount in
>     >>>> local currency that matters to the users.
>     >>>>
>     >>>>
>     >>>> On 03/13/2014 02:40 PM, Andreas Schildbach wrote:
>     >>>>> Indeed. And users were crying for mBTC. Nobody was asking for
>     >>>>> µBTC.
>     >>>>>
>     >>>>> I must admit I was not aware if this thread. I just watched
>     >>>>> other wallets and at some point decided its time to switch to
>     >>>>> mBTC.
>     >>>>>
>     >>>>>
>     >>>>> On 03/13/2014 02:31 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
>     >>>>>> The standard has become mBTC and that's what was adopted.
>     >>>>>> It's too late to try and sway this on a mailing list thread
>     >>>>>> now.
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Gary Rowe
>     >>>>>> <g.rowe@froot.co.uk <mailto:g.rowe@froot.co.uk>
>     <mailto:g.rowe@froot.co.uk <mailto:g.rowe@froot.co.uk>>
>     >>>>>> <mailto:g.rowe@froot.co.uk <mailto:g.rowe@froot.co.uk>>> wrote:
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>> The MultiBit HD view is that this is a locale-sensitive
>     >>>>>> presentation issue. As a result we offer a simple
>     >>>>>> configuration panel giving pretty much every possible
>     >>>>>> combination: icon, m+icon,  μ+icon, BTC, mBTC,  μBTC, XBT,
>     >>>>>> mXBT,  μXBT, sat along with settings for leading/trailing
>     >>>>>> symbol, commas, spaces and points. This allows anyone to
>     >>>>>> customise to meet their own needs beyond the offered default.
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>> We apply the NIST guidelines for representation of SI unit
>     >>>>>> symbols (i.e no conversion to native language, no RTL giving
>     >>>>>> icon+m etc).
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>> Right now MultiBit HD is configured to use m+icon taken from
>     >>>>>> the Font Awesome icon set. However reading earlier posts it
>     >>>>>> seems that μ+icon is more sensible.
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>> Let us know what you'd like.
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>> Links: m+icon screenshot: http://imgur.com/a/WCDoG Font
>     >>>>>> Awesome icon:
>     >>>>>> http://fortawesome.github.io/Font-Awesome/icon/btc/ NIST SI
>     >>>>>> guidelines: http://physics.nist.gov/Pubs/SP811/sec07.html
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>> On 13 March 2014 12:56, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@bitpay.com
>     <mailto:jgarzik@bitpay.com>
>     >>>>>> <mailto:jgarzik@bitpay.com <mailto:jgarzik@bitpay.com>>
>     >>>>>> <mailto:jgarzik@bitpay.com <mailto:jgarzik@bitpay.com>>> wrote:
>     >>>>>>
>     >>>>>> Resurrecting this topic.  Bitcoin Wallet moved to mBTC
>     >>>>>> several weeks ago, which was disappointing -- it sounded like
>     >>>>>> the consensus was uBTC, and moving to uBTC later --which will
>     >>>>>> happen-- may result in additional user confusion, thanks to
>     >>>>>> yet another decimal place transition.
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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  reply	other threads:[~2014-03-14 15:56 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 112+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2013-11-14 11:45 [Bitcoin-development] moving the default display to mbtc Melvin Carvalho
2013-11-14 18:18 ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-17  3:22   ` Jacob Lyles
2013-11-14 20:01 ` Alan Reiner
2013-11-14 21:15   ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-14 21:55     ` Allen Piscitello
2013-11-14 22:00       ` Alan Reiner
2013-11-14 22:07         ` Allen Piscitello
2013-11-14 23:01           ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-14 23:11             ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-14 23:13               ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-14 23:22               ` Jeff Garzik
2013-11-15  0:15               ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-15  0:18                 ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-16  0:41             ` Drak
2013-11-16  0:48               ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-16  1:10               ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-16  1:19                 ` Jean-Paul Kogelman
2013-11-16  1:19                 ` Drak
2013-11-16  1:31                   ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-15  8:55           ` Eugen Leitl
2013-11-14 22:21         ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-14 22:32         ` Drak
2013-11-14 22:37           ` Drak
2014-05-02 19:17       ` Jeff Garzik
2014-05-03  0:54         ` Ben Davenport
2014-05-03  1:13           ` Alan Reiner
2014-05-03  1:50             ` Aaron Voisine
2014-05-03  2:10             ` Matias Alejo Garcia
2014-05-03  2:38           ` Luke Dashjr
2014-05-03  2:41             ` Ben Davenport
2014-05-03  2:43             ` Peter Todd
2014-05-03  3:35             ` Un Ix
2014-05-03 12:32             ` Roy Badami
2014-05-03  4:23         ` Tamas Blummer
2013-11-14 22:03     ` Jeff Garzik
2013-11-14 22:31       ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-14 22:53         ` Alan Reiner
2013-11-14 23:01           ` Jeff Garzik
2013-11-14 23:10           ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-15  9:23           ` Eugen Leitl
2013-11-15  9:37             ` Alex Kravets
2013-11-15  9:59               ` Adam Back
2013-11-15 10:39               ` Eugen Leitl
2013-11-15  7:18       ` Wladimir
2013-11-18  2:28       ` Wendell
2014-03-13 12:56         ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 13:29           ` Gary Rowe
2014-03-13 13:31             ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 13:40               ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 14:05                 ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 14:14                   ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-14 14:49                     ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 14:57                       ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-14 15:02                         ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 15:12                           ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-14 15:30                             ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 15:32                           ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-14 15:56                             ` Andreas Schildbach [this message]
2014-03-14 16:01                       ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-03-14 16:15                         ` Alex Morcos
2014-03-14 16:51                           ` Ricardo Filipe
2014-03-14 16:58                             ` Allen Piscitello
2014-03-14 15:10                     ` Tyler
2014-03-14 14:18                   ` Roy Badami
2014-03-13 19:38               ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 13:34           ` Wladimir
2014-03-13 13:45             ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 13:53               ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 14:32                 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 15:50                   ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 16:17                     ` Troy Benjegerdes
2014-03-13 16:39                     ` Melvin Carvalho
2014-03-13 16:55                       ` Allen Piscitello
2014-03-13 17:13                         ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 17:23                           ` Allen Piscitello
2014-03-13 16:14                   ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-13 16:23                     ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-13 16:29                     ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 17:18                       ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-03-13 17:21                         ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 17:24                         ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 17:36                           ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-13 17:43                             ` Wladimir
2014-03-13 17:51                             ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 17:58                               ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-13 19:26                       ` Drak
2014-03-13 16:08               ` Troy Benjegerdes
2014-03-13 16:30                 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-13 16:37                   ` slush
2014-03-13 17:48                     ` Luke-Jr
2014-03-13 18:23                 ` Jorge Timón
2014-03-13 18:29                   ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 18:51                     ` Ben Davenport
2014-03-14  0:34                     ` Jorge Timón
2014-03-14 17:14                       ` vv01f
2014-03-14 20:13                         ` Natanael
2014-03-14  1:26                 ` Un Ix
2014-03-14 21:56           ` Odinn Cyberguerrilla
2013-11-15 10:45   ` Wladimir
2013-11-15 10:57     ` Eugen Leitl
2013-11-14 22:27 ` Drak
2013-11-15  0:05   ` Jeff Garzik
2013-11-15  0:37     ` Daniel F
2013-11-15  0:46       ` Melvin Carvalho
2013-11-15  0:57       ` Alan Reiner
2014-05-02 14:29 ` Melvin Carvalho
2013-11-15  5:21 Tamas Blummer
     [not found] <mailman.271337.1390426426.2210.bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
2014-03-13 15:17 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-13 15:37   ` Chris Pacia
2014-03-14 16:25 Andrew Smith
     [not found] <536537E2.1060200@stud.uni-saarland.de>
2014-05-03 18:46 ` Jannis Froese

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